No dig at you that your username brings to mind Abner Louima, the man who similarly sexually assualted in New York a few years ago.
Please don’t be offended.
[QUOTE=Qadgop the Mercotan]
Life in a max security prison will be suitable punishment, trust me. Their lives will be coned down, narrow, limited things, constrained by forces they are powerless against, as their physiology becomes institutionalized and they eat and excrete and sleep in accordance to when they are allowed/trained to.
[/QUOTE]
If you want to believe that, fine. Myself, I can’t help thinking about the Richard Speck videotape that surfaced after his death. Not the death by execution that should have happened in the '70s. The natural death that occurred in the '90s after feeding and sheltering that piece of shit for 25 years. There he was in his cell, high on drugs, cuddling his man-bitch and saying, “If they only knew how much fun I was having in here, they’d let me out.”
[QUOTE=Johnny Hildo]
If you want to believe that, fine. Myself, I can’t help thinking about the Richard Speck videotape that surfaced after his death. Not the death by execution that should have happened in the '70s. The natural death that occurred in the '90s after feeding and sheltering that piece of shit for 25 years. There he was in his cell, high on drugs, cuddling his man-bitch and saying, “If they only knew how much fun I was having in here, they’d let me out.”
[/QUOTE]
Since Qadgop actually works in a prison, I think he can speak with some authority as to what it’s like in there. That Speck tape is great for recreational outrage, but I don’t think it portrays an accurate picture of what prison is generally like. :dubious:
[QUOTE=Alice The Goon]
It’s nice to think that these scumbags will be miserable in prison, but the reality of it is this- they will be taken in by their own kind in there and be protected and made kings. 
[/QUOTE]
I have been thinking of starting a thread about this topic. When I was a lurker, long before I joined, I remember reading quite a few threads about whether or not a child molester is more likely to be raped or beaten in prison.
Some people were making cases against it, providing cites and everything. A couple posters even stated that they know or are married to guards, and they know it is only a myth that molesters are in more danger.
But this directly conflicts everything I have learned about the topic, before reading otherwise on the dope. Many ex-cons that I know, (don’t ask why I know ex-cons) have confirmed that indeed, there is a higher risk for molesters.
Also, I know I saw with my own eyes certain documentaries on MSNBC, and stuff like that where the guards came right out and said that many molesters are kept in protected areas, for that very reason.
But, Alice, I have digressed even before making my point. My original point was that I have been told by various people I know that have done prison time, there is no such thing as ‘being protected’. Anyone can get messed up. In fact, messing up someone who you know is supposed to be ‘protected’ is just the kind of thing to make you a big man.
Least of all skinheads can count on protection. They are the minority there. Or, so I’m told.
I wonder if that is really the case. I’ve seen the video and he is definitely the bitch. The drugs might have taken the edge off being a couple of guys fuck toy for probably his whole life in jail, but I have my doubts that his entire life in prison was like that, and after the drugs wear off your still the lowly bitch. I think he was indeed miserable under the surface.
[QUOTE=pool]
I wonder if that is really the case. I’ve seen the video and he is definitely the bitch. The drugs might have taken the edge off being a couple of guys fuck toy for probably his whole life in jail, but I have my doubts that his entire life in prison was like that, and after the drugs wear off your still the lowly bitch. I think he was indeed miserable under the surface.
[/QUOTE]
Richard Speck wasn’t exactly working with a full deck to start with, it’s really hard to say what his true feelings were about the situation.
[QUOTE=Nzinga, Seated]
Least of all skinheads can count on protection. They are the minority there. Or, so I’m told.
[/QUOTE]
I would imagine every prison is different. I know that at one point the Aryan Nations had a strong presence within prison walls, although I don’t know if that is a thing of the past since the Aryan Nations outside prison walls is basically in shambles these days.
I imagine that more important that the crime that sent you to prison the personal characteristics of the offender would play a large part in what sort of incarceration they have. I saw a documentary awhile back where a guy in his mid-60s serving a life sentence talked about his earliest days in prison (he went in when he was in his mid-20s.) He was 6’9" and like 300 lbs as a young man, and he said people still messed with him, and despite his size and even his skill in a fight, when it’s 3-4 guys you’re still going to lose most of the time. He said he usually did enough damage even when he lost fights that eventually he earned respect and people left him alone. So I imagine the tougher types may be able to overcome some of the nastiest parts of prison life.
But the two attackers in this case are two young, white, middle class teenagers. I honestly doubt they would do well in prison no matter what their crime was.
[QUOTE=Johnny Hildo]
If you want to believe that, fine. Myself, I can’t help thinking about the Richard Speck videotape that surfaced after his death. Not the death by execution that should have happened in the '70s. The natural death that occurred in the '90s after feeding and sheltering that piece of shit for 25 years. There he was in his cell, high on drugs, cuddling his man-bitch and saying, “If they only knew how much fun I was having in here, they’d let me out.”
[/QUOTE]
You can buy into his BS on the video if you like.
Me, I work in a max security prison, and am up close and personal with plenty of hardcore lifers. I’ve seen them die in prison.
I’ll stick with my assessment.
[QUOTE=Broomstick]
Actually, there’s no way, from the information we’re given, to know if getting rid of the colostomy bag was even possible. And while lots and lots of people have lived wonderful lives despite colostomy bags, let’s face it, they aren’t a wonderful thing to have to deal with every day of your life. In his case, it was probably a constant reminder of the rape.
And I wonder, given the time frame, if that wasn’t a factor in all this - not so much the colostomy bag itself but the dawning realization that yes, there is permanent damage and it really is forever. What can be dealt with over a couple weeks or months is perhaps not so easy for years on end. Likewise, he might have felt he would never stop hearing about the attack.
On top of that - was there any pressure for him to be the saintly survivor? All this talk about him rising above it and being happy and normal… you know, that’s NOT a normal reaction to getting ass-fucked by a giant pole to the point of needing reconstructive surgery. That is, in fact, less normal than being depressed and having crying episodes about it. Were there cultural factors leading him to hide his desperation? Avoid counseling? Was he teased (because people are unbelievably cruel)? Was there an unconcious rewarding of stiff-upper-lip behavior and a non-verbal but clear disapproval of him showing negative feelings here?
I don’t know. And there isn’t enough information here to know. But I do wonder.
[/QUOTE]
Oh, yeah, I hear ya. I should clarify that I was thinking in terms of the possibility (IANAnMD)–or, rather, the hope–of him losing the bag somewhere down the road, i.e., in the not-too-distant future.
I don’t disagree with your other points, either. Your point re cultural factors vis-a-vis counseling and keeping a stiff upper lip was a good one, and one that had not escaped me when I first became aware of this. After all, the article that **Cartooniverse ** linked to (and the one that I’d earlier read elsewhere) did mention (or at least imply) that he was urged to get counseling but had resisted the idea.
Could he have been teased because people are cruel? As much I don’t want to believe that, I know perfectly well that people can be unbelievably cruel and insensitive, so I can’t discount it as a possibility. How likely is this to have occurred? I don’t know, but I do think that it’s likely that there’s an amalgamation of things that led this young man to take his own life.
And what a goddamn shame that is. Like I said, poor baby.
[QUOTE=Qadgop the Mercotan]
You can buy into his BS on the video if you like.
Me, I work in a max security prison, and am up close and personal with plenty of hardcore lifers. I’ve seen them die in prison.
I’ll stick with my assessment.
[/QUOTE]
Because you’re obviously there at the end of the day when the lights go out and you know everything. I wish I was as omniscient as you.
Well, QtM has spent enough years working in that environment that around these parts, his opinions in this area are regarded as heavily fact- and experience-based. Likely he has been there when the population has bedded down for the night !
Speaking of said expertise, QtM is there anything to the comments about the Aryan Nations not really being so deeply influential inside the prison system overall any more? I wonder about such comments. The media may not be heavily reporting on a story but that doesn’t mean it has magically gone away. For example, a few weeks ago there was quite a stir about a story on ( I think ) CNN about gangs like the Crips and the Bloods inside the military being posted to Iraq and Afghanistan. Did gang membership magically surge with the surge two months ago? Not hardly. But the story was hot for a few days.
I wonder if this is the case with white supremacists in the prisons. Thoughts?
Cartooniverse
[QUOTE=Johnny Hildo]
Because you’re obviously there at the end of the day when the lights go out and you know everything. I wish I was as omniscient as you.
[/QUOTE]
On the other hand, Qadgop the prison doc - if anyone is going to turn up evidence of ass-raping in prison I’d think it would be the guy having to investigate bleeding anuses.
I don’t suppose you considered the possibility that Speck made those comments delibrately in order to provoke outrage? He wasn’t a stupid man, but he was a bad one who didn’t have qualms about hurting other people. It’s not like he had any other way of getting back at society for caging him, other than saying provacative shit.
[QUOTE=Johnny Hildo]
Because you’re obviously there at the end of the day when the lights go out and you know everything. I wish I was as omniscient as you.
[/QUOTE]
Don’t mind Johnny – he’s still wishing he knew how to address letters.
[QUOTE=Soapbox Monkey]
Surgically? Surgery implies precision. These men don’t deserve that. They ought to be sat down on a pool drain and eviscerated.
Either that or they should be beaten to within an inch of their lives. Then when they recover, they’re beaten again. Lather, rinse, repeat for the rest of their lives.
[/QUOTE]
Because with an operation complete with prompt medical care, and meds you cant be accused of torturing them.
[QUOTE=pool]
I wonder if that is really the case. I’ve seen the video and he is definitely the bitch. The drugs might have taken the edge off being a couple of guys fuck toy for probably his whole life in jail, but I have my doubts that his entire life in prison was like that, and after the drugs wear off your still the lowly bitch. I think he was indeed miserable under the surface.
[/QUOTE]
That’s what I got from the video. It looked like he was trying to put a good face on a lousy situation, and it looked to me like he was being abused by the other guys.