I think Cameron and Derek were both sent back from 2027, but on this show, which day would probably make a difference.
Once the gang jumped forward to 2007, they’d seriously messed with the future (Sarah should be already dead), and I believe 2007 is also when Derek showed up.
That’s something that has not been dealt with enough on the show. I think that at some point Cameron is going to tell John that he’s secretly dead in 2029 and that she sent herself back to try to change that because she loves him.
That’s a very interesting idea - hopefully if it DOES happen we’ll get to see what killed John.
-Joe
I have to disagree. Imo, Ellison is teaching him to be a believer, Weaver adds the (anticipation of) disappointment that turns belief into zealotry.
One of the more interesting aspects of the Terminator universe is the idea that timelines are changed by every action but still lead invariably to the conjuncture of judgment day and the confrontation between Skynet and John Connor.
That’s an interesting point you bring up! I think my optimism helped me overlook it. Either way, I can’t wait to see what happens.
CHRIST!!
Someone should shoot Garret Dillahunt. I just saw him in Last House in the Left, on Life and on here. I remember him on Damages, John From Cincinati, Deadwood, The 4400, ER and on a rerun of No Country for Old Men. I think he was on all the CSI’s, all the Law and Order’s and practically on every NBC show.
Just let him finish his run on this show. He’s doing a good job.
-Joe
theory: Cameron’s malfunctions have nothing to do with physical damage.
She was programmed to follow Future Johns instructions if they conflicted with Past John. Time travel doesn’t work that way though, every time someone gets sent back things change. She’s programmed to protect Past John even if she has to disobey him, but turns out there is no future john. there’s just john. hence her programmings getting a bit wiggy.
Finally caught up. That whole dream/sleep lab/kidnapped episode was majorly eff-ed up. I’d like to pretend it didn’t happen, but she mentioned being kidnapped in the next episode.
I also don’t like Jesse that much, but the latest episodes gave her some sympathy. Essentially, John has become so wrapped up that he has insulated himself against seeing humans and is relying on Cameron as his go-between - that is seriously bad news.
I understand that reprogrammed Terminators can be a valuable asset. Maybe having the sub commander being one has merit, since sub-piloting takes specific skills that a human may not have had the chance to acquire. But to place a Terminator in command over the humans, and give him secret orders without any humans present being aware of what they are and the objective, that is inviting paranoia and revolt. Humans aren’t machines, even in the military, and the humans in that military don’t have the advantage of the formalized training of our military. You know, boot camp to shake up and remold the troops.
So you have a top secret mission to obtain and return some unspecified payload, and the only one who knows what is going on is a Terminator. Yeah, the humans are going to go along with that. That is STUPID. John, if you really did that, you suck as a leader.
Which gives more merit to John being disabled/dead and Cameron covering for him. She doesn’t realize the inherent problem because people are not machines. They’re soldiers, they’re supposed to follow orders, end of story. Except they’re humans, and are afraid for their lives, and the one running the show is one of the machines trying to kill them.
Shirley is way creepy, and that Ellison hasn’t noticed severely weakens my opinion of him. Also, the whole “teach faith to the machine” seems way wrong to me. Of course, how do you teach ethics and morals? How do you establish the value of humans and sanctity of life?
Also, I have a hard time accepting Ellison being in on the job. How can he not see that he’s helping create the very computer system that he knows will be evil? Somehow he thinks he can reshape it so it won’t be evil, by giving it ethics?
Also, submarines are not fighter jets. You can’t pull up when you reach your depth and instantly be holding steady. Grrr.
Maybe it’s backwards. Maybe it isn’t John trying to remake the past to try to keep John alive and get things on the right track.
Maybe it’s about Cameron (who is actually running the resistance in the future, if John is dead) learning what she needs to know so that in the future she doesn’t make mistakes like the whole setup with the 'bot running the sub.
-Joe
-“There is another system,” eh? 
-Heh. Brain Burning-fu. 'Sure friggin beats agonizing about your possible “fate” and interpersonal statuses. Now that’s the Sarah Connor we love!
-Aaaaand…they’ve officially retconned the dates/established the series as being in a slightly different universe than the one we saw in T2.
Or maybe Cameron’s head contains future John’s mind. Whoa.
So, John Henry died and then was resurrected, huh? ‘My God, why hast thou forsaken me’? Well, it is almost Easter.
I think Ellison needs to lose a little of his naive belief – ‘There’s demons?’, that was kind of an eye-roller.
In episode 19, Derek acknowledged the fact that the Jesse he had met in the present, is from a different future than the one he knew/will have known, whatever; and now the writers let him act (again) as if the Jesses were identical. He won’t be/wouldn’t have been the father, and he knows, should know. Sigh.
So, whoever gave the guy (real time) instructions how to disable Cameron and get her chip failed to mention that the window of opportunity closes in about a minute? Sigh 2.
It doesn’t seem to matter how often team Connor gets into trouble by NOT communicating at all – they carry on regardless. Sigh 3.
You get a transmitter transplanted into your body and the tissue heals, just like that? Sigh 4.
Well, it’s not quite that easy with emotional attachments, I think. She looks like Jesse, talks like Jesse, probably does quite a lot of other things like Jesse, in fact she is Jesse for all practical purposes; the rational knowledge that she’s not really totally identical to the Jesse he knew doesn’t really hold a candle to that.
That was the other AI – John Henry’s ‘brother’, who downloaded the plans when he accessed John Henry, perhaps scanning his body or whatever. He may not have known that there’s a safety backup, or maybe Cameron was insulated.
They made quite a big thing this episode about not trusting each other, well, Sarah did.
Sarah was a bit banged up and bruised after her kidnapping, one little cut more most likely wouldn’t have aroused much suspicion.
I see your point – but his previous acknowledgment of the facts was, from my pov, the one reason why I could see him actually pull the trigger (or at least consider it seriously). If he could come to that decision based on the facts, his later reaction seemed strange.
So far, all terminator AI knew about the reboot feature – why should that one not know it or fail to address this very important point?
But Sarah’s and Cameron’s priority is John’s survival – and yet, both fail to inform him about a current attack that seemed to be well planned … No, I would have followed your logic if Sarah had to warn Derek or Cameron … – but not when it comes to John. It’s just stupid (writing).
But a little cut right under a never before felt lump in her breast? All right, given her track record, I see your point.
It wasn’t a terminator AI, though, just a contemporary (probably proto-terminator) one – its knowledge of the intricacies of terminator endoskeletons and their functions was gleaned from a brief scan of John Henry’s body, perhaps the reboot feature wasn’t obvious from that, or the reboot time at least; that might be a programming thing, and I think we are to assume that Cromartie’s original programming’s gone. Or, as I said before, Cameron has learned and simply wore padded soles, or whatever, though that would have to be indicated somewhere in the show in order to not make it simply lazy writing.
Yeah, it’s a bit strange that nobody even tried to call anybody on their cell – would have been a second screen time, show the ringing phone lying around somewhere, dropped, whatever, and would have tied things together far better.
Well, she did eventually feel the lump, and it probably didn’t develop right away, anyway.
Ah, thanks. I must have missed some dialogue. I hadn’t realized that we had already learned that no future player was responsible for/involved in the attack / or sent the worm. And I hadn’t considered that the infiltration of John Henry (that seemed to take place at the same time as the attack) was crucial to get the information how to disable a terminator in the first place. Now it makes more sense.
Fuck! That sucked ass! I was so happy to see Charlie again. Bastards!
Other than that, great ep. Lots of juicy stuff going on. Derek & Cameron are sorta bonding in their weird ways.
I agree JH’s “brother” wouldn’t know exactly what Cameron’s reset time is, and would have to guess. You have 1:00. Oops, guess it was 0:30. But, how does this new AI know about Cameron? Where is that information floating around? On what computer network? Actually, this group seems to know all about Sarah’s group, and it’s Miles Dyson’s AI?
JH: “Yes. We can change the rules.” :eek: Uh-oh. Thanks a lot Savannah. Quit giving JH ideas.
So the bad guys this ep were who? The same guys who have an HK, worked for Weaver and/or an “overseas” organization? Did Miles Dyson’s AI infiltrate Weavers lab? Did Weaver know, and that’s why she killed (almost) everyone there?
I first thought that her suggestion to change the rules were responsible for his breakdown – which, in turn, enabled some backup chip (hidden within his body) that started to gain control. If I built killer robots I’d make sure that the chip in the head wouldn’t be the only one. Isn’t redundancy one of the prime principles of military systems?
That makes sense. And it means that the other party is indeed an established and well known player … who else but (proto-)Skynet?
Which would affirm the suspicions that Weaver is the third party …