Bill said:
Recommended reading: The Best Little Boy in the World by “John Reed” (Andrew Tobias). Outstanding insight into oneself by an excellent writer whose feelings about the entire subject seem to echo yours in many ways.
From the Garth Brooks song “We shall be free”
Well I think highly of both Snark and Orange. So, guys I wish you both the best as you explore this new relationship.
Jeffery
Thank you to those who are being supportive of this. Rose and I both believe that this can work. The major obstacles are not sexual, but psychological and religious. I prefer being alone a lot, which would have to change should we get serious. Rose would have to give up her religion, which I don’t pretend would be easy for her to do. Only Rose knows whether she will ultimately make that decision or not.
But dammit, we like each other, and we appreciate the supporting posts many people have made in this thread. Homosexual agendas notwithstanding, we believe this could work. Analyzing it to death and calling me “immoral” (for trying to be what I consider to be “moral,” no less!) won’t change the fact that I LIKE ROSE. So na-na-na-na-naaaaa-naaaaa! (j/k)
Congrats, Snark and OC. (So does this mean you and Orangie are going to be flirting even more? Like we didn’t see this coming a mile away with all the schmoopiness between you two.) You seem to have a pretty good handle on the possible problems. No one ever knows how things will work out, but if you two are honest with each other I think you have the best chance of working things out. I hope you guys are happy together. (Oh, and if you do decide to get married and invite the Dope crew, try to have the wedding during snow season, Okay? I hear Park City and Snowbird calling my name… 
)
Gaudere, like I said, we’re going to take this very slow. I initially told Rose that if she wanted to marry me, she’d have to convert and wait 10 years. The latter was a joke, but had an element of truth in it. The fact is, right now I’m not psychologically prepared to get married. I don’t see a wedding in the near future. But we’ll try to make it during the skiing season if it happens at all!
<small>You’re schmoopy!
No, you’re schmoopy!</small>
Snark and OC - best of luck to you two. Are there risks? Of course - there are in any relationship. Are there risks specifically because of Snark’s sexuality? Of course - but you both know what you’re getting into.
The worst that can happen is that it doesn’t work out, and you learn a bit more about yourselves in the process. IMO, that always beats the hell out of staying on the sidelines and wondering what might’ve happened. So go for it, and have a good time!
P.S. I second Gaudere on the ski-season sentiment. :)Snowbird! 
RT–are you a rider or a two-planker? Snowbird has kickin’ powder, but I like Park City and Brighton’s runs. I’m going to the Alps this March!
Gaudere - I’ve only done conventional skiing; snowboarding was in its infancy the last time I skied. But I’m always up to trying new things. (Though, with respect to skiing, first I’ve gotta see whether this aging body’s still up to the old ones.)
Alps, huh? As the real Rufus T. Firefly said, the Lord Alps those who Alp themselves. Enjoy, and tell us all about it when you get back!
(OK, Bill and Rose, I’ll stop hijacking your thread now… :))
Snark:
Could you 'splain that?
Okay I’m back from lunch.
Boy, This has turned out to be an interesting thread! I was sleeping when snark posted it,and certainly didn’t expect the title(LOL).
Thank you to those of you who wish us well(some I’ve never even corresponded with)(and wheres kelli? to wish me well???)
But thanks for explaining it a bit better from your standpoint, Bill.
You all seem to be jumping the gun here, too! And I can just see Arg coming after me if I convert!
Hey, I love shmoopiness, and I’ve gotten quite a bit of it in my personal e-mails from my honey(some of which were R-rated, BTW)
I’ve both skied and snowboarded; I prefer to snowboard and have my own setup. I can still outski my brother when I decide to ski (or am forced to by pain-in-the-ass resorts like Alta, which don’t allow riders), not that I’m amazingly good at either yet. I’ve only just learned to ride fakie (so now I can go down a hill by spinning around and around like a top. It’s fun and it freaks out the skiers) and to carve properly on a board. Every time I go over a big jump I have an equally big wipeout. Not that that stops me from doing it, I just tend to wait until the last day to go kamikazi so that if I cripple myself I won’t miss any slope time.
OK, back to Bill and Rose’s love life, for sure this time…
Libertarian wrote:
It means simply that I like to look at other men but don’t want to have sex with them. Yes, I know I’m a pervert in this area, but I’m working on it.
Good luck to you both, but let me say this Snark, the line below doesnt bode well for the equality and compromise ideas found in any relationship
[quote]
I have told Rose that I won’t marry a non-Mormon. She will have to decide, should our relationship get that far, whether she wants to join the LDS church or not. That’s totally her decision, not mine.
[quote/]
Dont be selfish and dont set yourself up to fail, be willing to compromise. Otherwise good luck.
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him. "
Jonathan Swift
Snark honey,I’m so happy for you!! I don’t know Orangecakes very well, but you and I go back to the days when snakes were just a quarter… I wish you both the very best, and will offer you just one word of advice: COMMUNICATE. That’s really all it takes, but there has to be a LOT of it, it has to be two-way, and it has to be sincerely honest. After that, the rest is cake…
{{{{Bill and Rose}}}}
StoryTyler
Distinguished Big-Hootered Assistant to Criminally Insane Doctor,
Self-Righteous Clique
“Not everybody does it, but everybody should.”
Snark, from all of your posts regarding your sexuality it appears that basically you are a person who is primarily gay whose religious conditioning actively fights against the natural urges that you have within yourself.
One of my best friends (the excommuncated one) and another older gentleman whom I know fairly well both had to deal with the exact same issues you are currently dealing with. Anyway, I have spoken about friend A before and now I will give acaquantance B as an example.
This acquantance is gay but totally rejects all the feelings that he has towards gayness insomuch that in order for him to actually have sex with someone, they have to mummify (very creepy S&M scene) him. He enjoys having sex with men but feels such total guilt and “dirtiness” after it is done that he typically either drinks himself silly, tries to kill himself, or harms himself in some physical way. Not to say that his case was typical, it isn’t. Usually, gay people grow to accept themselves as gay individuals. Anyway, a comparative analogy to yourself will probably not be accurate because his case was extreme.
Anyway, the reason I am bringing this subject up again is because everytime I see you post about your sexuality you remind me of this person. He was in denial for a very long time (he’s in his 50’s) insomuch that he married and had two children with a woman. After he could no longer control his urges (he never slept around on his wife) he bought some gay porn. His wife found it, freaked out and divorced him (this was put rather simply). Anyway, to this day, about 15 years later, his children will not talk to him becuase he raised them to be good little “homophobes”. I don’t want to see this happen to you because I have seen so much of it already with the older gay generations. It is hurtful to everyone involved. I know I am jumping the gun on this because neither you nor orangecakes knows what will happen. I am just throwing in a cautionary word.
orangecakes, you should know better, again, about the X-rated emails. I am sure your former husband did something similar in the beginning.
HUGS!
Sqrl
PS. I wish both you and orangecakes luck in finding happiness.
Dear Fascist Bully Boys,
Give me more money, you bastards.
May the seed of your loins prove fruitful in the belly of your woman.
neil
Thanks Story, yes, we communicate quite well. He’s told me all the details of his life,etc. He knows stuff about me I’ve never told anyone(and never will). Thank God for e-mail. Also phones.
Someday I’m gonna post a photo so you all can see what a total Babe he is!!!
PS. Snark, send me your email if you like at paganbearcub@hotmail.com and I will get in touch with a certified sex therapist that I know who heads a clinic in New Hampshire and let him and/or you get a real dialogue going. He has been doing this type of work for just about 30 years and he could explain things about yourself significantly better than I. Also, he can help you along the way to better accepting/understanding yourself as a gay/bi/straight man, whichever you turn out to be.
I really wish you the best and think therapy for simple acceptance would be the best thing you can do. If you don’t send me the email or talk to my friend, I wish that you would talk to someone who is non-partial and non-religious about these issues. Hiding who you are (not saying that you do within your church) is never a good thing but accepting who you are always is.
HUGS!
Sqrl
Dear Fascist Bully Boys,
Give me more money, you bastards.
May the seed of your loins prove fruitful in the belly of your woman.
neil
SQuirel, ! First of all, my former husband did no such thing(and what did you mean anyway?) I did Not say x-rated, now did I/ I said R-rated.
And thanks SO much for your support. At risk of sullying my sweeties thread, I gotta say to you:up yours 
StarvinMarvin wrote:
[qoute]Good luck to you both, but let me say this Snark, the line below doesnt bode well for the equality and compromise ideas found in any relationship
[quote]
I have told Rose that I won’t marry a non-Mormon. She will have to decide, should our relationship get that far, whether she wants to join the LDS church or not. That’s totally her decision, not mine.
Oh, I’m not being selfish. I just don’t believe that an inter-faith marriage would work, especially since the Assembly of God and the CoJCoLDS are pretty much incompatible with each other. I would want my children raised as Mormon, should we have children at all. I’m not being selfish when I want that for them, although I realize that Rose has her own religious convictions that may be just as strong as mine. The bottom line is, if we aren’t both LDS, it could never work, IMHO.
Yea. I’ve been reading this thread since the beginning, and stayed out of it, until I read that from you Rose. I’d actually prefer to say this to you by email, but what the hey, everything is out in the open anyway.
You will convert Rose. 
If the relationship goes further than boyfriend/girlfriend, you will follow Bill into the Mormon faith.
If you consider me your brother, then you will take this not as me being judgemental, but as a gentle warning. Just, please be careful Rose. And pray that God’s will is done, and not your own.
Adam
“Life is hard…but God is good”