My fiancé and I just moved from Tennessee to Toronto, Ontario to be closer to his family (he is Canadian been living in the states for the past 5 years, I am from he U.S.). His mom loves dogs and volunteers for a pet rescue in Ontario. She fosters dogs at her farm house on >100 acres and has 12 large breed dogs currently living inside her kitchen. The dogs go outside and are well taken care of, and she keeps her home as clean as possible, given that there are 12 dogs (although I’ve gotten my share of dog hair in my mouth after using a cloth napkin) The issue is that she is now tethered to her home and says she is unable to travel the 1.5 hours to come see our new apartment in Toronto because there’s nobody to watch the dogs. As an immigrant, I would hope to receive moral support from my soon to be mother in law, but she refuses to make the trip, on account of the dogs. There have been numerous other things she has missed out on / not been “able” to do. We feel she places the dogs before her family. I feel she is a narcissist who is using the dogs as an excuse and to establish herself as a martyr. She is always (constantly, annoyingly) complaining about not being able to do certain things, or afford certain things, while she just spent 5,000 on surgery for one dog, and she does nothing to reduce the number of dogs she has living with her. We love dogs, but we feel her pack is interfering with her life and her potential happiness. She will not acknowledge this as an issue and becomes very defensive when we bring it up. Please help. I want to build a strong relationship with her (especially now that I live here)but I fear this will prevent us from being able to do that.
This’d be one for Carolyn Hax. I’d definitely be talking with a behavioral therapist before I married into the family (and read a few books on the topic), and naturally deciding what you’re willing to tolerate now v. later. I doubt it’s so simple as “narcissist”, though that disorder is clearly in the mix.
There are one-liners to interrupt and deflect from her constant complaining.
At any rate, you must put the “hope” for “moral support” aside and ask yourself if you’re willing to tolerate as-is (worst-case scenario). Whatever friction there is now will only get worse after the marriage.
You can’t fix other people’s problems. Reach out and be kind to the mother-in-law, but recognize that she’s the only one who can reach back. If she doesn’t make effort for a good relationship, you won’t have one, and you can’t make her make effort. And that’s okay – not everyone will have a great relationship with the in-laws.
So just accept it. Work to have a good relationship with your soon-to-be husband.
And, yes, naturally it’s bullshit that she “can’t” find someone to pay to stay at the house and watch the dogs for a day or a week.
How about when you two crazy kids start spitting out some bebbies… will Grandma still be too busy with her dogs to visit or help with her grandkids?
lieu How about when you two crazy kids start spitting out some bebbies… will Grandma still be too busy with her dogs to visit or help with her grandkids?
Yes, I worry about that, too.
Among many other things, Carolyn would say a third party professional would help give the family the tools to find ways to observe to that the mother spends far more time grousing about the dogs than enjoying them, and seems to want to dwell in a problem rather than … fix it. If she’s been allowed to do this for decades and people don’t distance themselves from her, the solutions’ll likely have to be the tough love route, up to and including pointedly changing the topic whenever she starts bitching about something that’s a self-sabotage situation. (For all we know, she’s got various anxiety disorders that she’s refusing to face, and the dogs are her excuse.)
I have several dogs, cats and horses. I rarely go away for more than a day, although I will sometimes travel to a destination one day and come home on the next. An hour and a half would be no big deal. However, I think that pinning your hopes for support from her may be more than she’s willing to give.
StG
Write off Mom-in-law. At best she’s always gonna be just like she is now. At worst she slowly turns into a marginally sane dog hoarder.
I’d be looking real seriously at her son (ie your intended) to see what similar foibles he may have. Right now they may seem “cute” or well under control. But as Mom gets crazier he’s going to be forced by circumstances to choose between supporting / enabling her vs. writing her off to stay with you.
Be darn sure you know now which way he will go then.
I can kind of relate to her. About a year ago I had 3 pigeons show up that were looking for food. I went and bought some pigeon food and started feeding them. Now I have a hundred pigeons showing up. I feel like I have to be there to feed them and I know it is crazy on my part. I am tempetd to put out a big net catch them all and do them in all at once! But until then I keep feeding, it makes no sense.
Wait–having raised her child(ren) she is now living, presumably, the way she wants to live, and for this you call her a narcissist?
You all seem to be thinking that the whole reason for existence of parents is to support their children however the children want it, forever. That they should have no other life, and in fact they should be grateful you let them babysit their grandkids.
News flash: Some people feel that once their kids are launched into adulthood, they can go on to pursue other things of interest to them. It doesn’t mean they don’t care. It just means their priorities are different.
A 1.5-hour drive is actually a 3-hour drive round trip and I assume there’s going to be a couple of hours of socialization on top of that. Of course you are excited about your new apartment, but that doesn’t mean she is. Send her some pictures.
I was going to say something similar, but you summed it up nicely.
MAYBE she has some issues, or maybe she just likes her dogs and her current life more than she likes you. It’s possible.
What Hilarity says. She’s an adult. She gets to live her life as she wants, assuming she isn’t hurting anyone. You get the same privilege; it’s the really neat thing about being a gownup.
Look on the bright side: she’s not all up in your business! I’m sure many would LOVE to trade MILs with you.
Hijacking to ask about this. Why are you feeding the pigeons if you don’t want to?
Feral pigeons are an invasive species, and out-compete native bird species in urban environments. They are also a significant potential vector for pathogens, especially for people with depressed immune systems. Cite for possible health risks.
If you stop feeding them, they’ll leave. They probably won’t die - pigeons are very adaptable - but you keep giving them a reason to return, so they do.
If you want to feed wild birds, wait til your pigeon flock has left, and target local native species. This site has good basics.
I know you are right and I have no rational reason beyond it bothers me to think they are hungry. I would not bother me in the least to kill everyone of them if I could do it humanely. What really gets me is I see all the young ones skinny and struggling. Now they are all fat with lustrous coats. The more I feed the more they breed. I agree I have to stop when the feed runs out.
When people ask me why I have 7 dogs, my answer is, “Eight would be crazy”.
Anyway we do just fine in the doing things department. I hire house/dog sitters, make use of doggie hotels, my kids, etc.
While it might be annoying, and might even possibly be a convenient way for your future MIL to avoid getting too involved with the humans in her life…I don’t get why this matters to you? If she’s actually fostering and not hoarding or mistreating/neglecting the dogs, this is a choice she has made. I suppose you can learn to tune out the complaints or excuses one way or another. Or politely tell her you don’t want to hear it, as the situation warrants.
She’s not obligated to babysit your future children, either.
I have three dogs and (with two neighbors) care for and TNR a feral cat community. While it’s definitely work and a responsibility, I share the cat duties, and have friends who can let the dogs out if I’m working a long day or whatever.
I’m curious, though. If she is fostering, why is the rescue letting her keep that many dogs at once? And aren’t they helping with the care and cost? I fostered dogs for 30 years, and any minimally-well-heeled rescue has a lot of supportive people on hand, plus vets who will provide reduced-cost treatment, stores that donate food and supplies, etc. And no well-run rescue will let a foster home provider become overwhelmed with more animals that they can responsibly care for. (Twelve large-breed dogs being kept in a kitchen does not sound like good care, or responsible stewardship, to me!) The way you describe it, she’s doing this on her own?
In any case, her life, her choice. I don’t see a problem, except that you don’t like that she is doing this.
To clarify, she has officially adopted 8 of the 12 dogs, so only 4 are actual fosters. I don’t know why the rescue allows her so many, especially when they run a strenuous home check in all potential adopters. She keeps adopting them one by one so that now the majority are hers. And she does so sneakily. Her partner is fed up. When you go into the kitchen, you can hardly walk among the sea of dogs. I said once maybe she could put them in another room at least when we eat dinner (imagine 12 noses in your plate as you’re trying to eat dinner) but she got very defensive even after I tried to nicely suggest a baby gate. Yes she gets lots of assistance from the rescue in terms of paying for food and vetting, but she’s adopted some of the most special needs dogs which couldn’t find homes on account that they would be too expensive for the average person to care for. A few take meds daily and have permanent health problems.
like constant seizures (not sure why she doesn’t put that dog down humanely). II JUST found out yesterday she got two kittens (mousers), left them locked in the kitchen with all the dogs, and came home to a dead kitten!. She already replaced it with a new kitten! Said she’ll ‘figure something out’ after I pleaded with her to move the kittens someplace else. You see, she doesn’t want to get hair on or wreck her antique rugs and nice furniture in the rest of the house, so while she has all these animals, they’re only allowed to go into the kitchen, sunroom and hallway.
Also, I wouldn’t expect her to babysit for us if we were to have babies someday would just want her to be in our kids life as a loving grandmother. I don’t have very much family of my own, so I guess it was wishful thinking on my part.
I would agree with you here, but the thing is, she is constantly complaining about never being able to go anywhere. To the point of obsession. Talking to her is like a broken record of complaints … It’s the exact same convo every time:
Her: "well I can’t go, I’ve gotta watch these stupid dogs "
Me (or anyone else who happens to be listening): “why don’t you tell the rescue you need to find someplace else for them? You can’t keep taking dogs, you know”
Her: “and This dog needs shots, you know why he’s walking around like that, he’s all doped up on his meds…”
This, in case you didn’t read into it, is a refusal to acknowledge any logical solution to the problem of her own making.
Stop providing solutions to her problems. You’ll never get her to agree with any solution that you offer.
You need some new phrases for when she brings up her problems:
‘Gosh, that sounds complicated. What are you going to do?’
‘Gosh, that sounds difficult. What are you going to do?’
‘Gosh, that sounds upsetting. What are you going to do?’
ALWAYS put the onus on her to come up with a solution. And when she can’t come up with one, say something sympathetic like ‘Oh, that’s too bad. I hope you can come up with a solution some day.’
And if she asks for your advice, you say ‘Gosh, I don’t know, that’s not a situation I’ve ever been in.’
And if she keeps bringing up the same problems, then say ‘Gosh, that’s the problem you told me about last week, isn’t it? Still not decided what you’re going to do about it?’
It takes some practice, but it will transform your relationship with your MIL. She’ll either get sick of you constantly asking her what she’s going to do about her problems and stop talking to you about them, or she’ll actually get motivated to do something about them herself. Either way, it’s win win for your relationship with her.