Trump and Melania test positive for COVID-19

Politics & Elections
503

Sadly, I think Pence has a better chance of defeating Biden than Trump does. And it scares me, because I have lived in Indiana under Pence. He actually believes a lot of the things Trump professes. So, in a sense, he has more integrity, but he also has theocratic tendencies that Trump does not.

Pence was raised a Roman Catholic, and later became a born-again Evangelical. I’m not sure what denomination he officially belongs to, but he was a regular church-goer, and at one time proselytizer.

Pence may not be able to rally a “base” like Trump has, because I don’t think he has a cult-type personality, but he does have charismatic appeal-- more than Biden. Personally, he makes me sick, but that’s just me. Anyone who agrees with him is going to like him. Biden, on the other hand, depends on people agreeing with him, because he’s really not terribly likable-- that’s not to say, he’s dislikable, he’s just not someone you want to pal around with, and Pence is, assuming that you even minimally share his viewpoints. I don’t know if I’m expressing that well-- I mean that, people who like Pence love him; people who agree with Biden don’t necessarily like him.

Most people I know who are planning to vote for Biden aren’t really enthusiastic about it. They are either in their minds voting for the Democratic party, or against Trump.

I think that while Pence won’t inspire the cult-like devotion Trump has, facing Biden sets the bar very low. He doesn’t need to be Trump.

HOWEVER, given how unpopular Pence eventually was in Indiana, I think the one saving grace is that he has a good chance of being a one-termer. I think he’ll very much be a George Bush following up on a Ronald Reagan.

504

In the abstract, I would agree that Pence is a better election candidate; more palatable for the broader right-wing.

But the circumstances matter here.
If hypothetically Trump dies or is otherwise unable to campaign for office, it’s very tough for another guy to quickly run on stage, pull the mic out of Trump’s gray hand and start complaining about the Dems. The fuckup is beyond even FOX news’ handwave ability.

In this hypothetical, the only way I see republicans holding the white house is if there is absolute chaos; e.g. trump dies on the day of the election, or there is widespread violence, or any circumstance that results in turnout of 40% or less.

505

I wish I had the chops to create a meme with six images:
Trump, with a “plus” sign
Melania, with a “plus” sign
Thom Tillis, with a “plus” sign
Mike Lee, with a “plus” sign
Kellyanne Conway, with a “plus” sign
A chameleon

506

It’s true some people on the left will also come up with conspiracy theories. The thing is, those theories don’t get much traction among the general run of leftists.

507

I don’t know … I think he’s got a bit of a point. I’m as anti-Trump, non-CT-believing as the next cynic, but I’ve heard nothing but scuttlebutt - both online and around the proverbial water cooler - about how no one is going to believe it until they either hear it from Fauci or see a body. And, to my shame, I didn’t really have a compelling argument against it int the breaking moments of the news.

508

The difference, IMO, is that in this case the leftist conspiracy theory — that Trump doesn’t really have COVID — is based on an observable pattern of behavior (Trump lying about damn near everything out of habit) while the right wing conspiracy theories — e.g., that the Dems infected Trump’s mic at the debate, or that it’s all part of some sixth-dimensional “rope-a-dope” plan — are based on ideas that would have been laughed out of a Twilight Zone writers’ meeting.

509

I’m not sure assuming a compulsive liar is lying is really so much a conspiracy theory as common sense for an immediate response. That cry has died down a bit now that more details are being released.

510

I hope not. That experiential drug he took? I’m counting on it to save my life in due time. I’m kinda serious here. Vaccines are always imperfect, and likely to be less perfect for this virus than for many. A big ole dose of effective antibodies is a really good back stop to an imperfect vaccine.

511

Speculation in the early hours of a ‘fog of war’ event, speculation based upon known patterns of behavior, is not the same as a years-old, insane, idiotic conspiracy theory which has no grounding in reality. Junior.

512

This is not a conspiracy theory. It is reasoned, seasoned reluctance to believe a lying con man.

513

Much if not all of that has to do with their status in society, not their skin color.

514

Speculation in the early hours of a ‘fog of war’ event, speculation based upon known patterns of behavior, is not the same as a years-old, insane, idiotic conspiracy theory which has no grounding in reality. Junior.

True, but it’s a very shallow understanding of that behaviour. He’s never taken a short term loss for a long term gain - that would suggest a level of sophistication and maturity that is miles beyond him. What he does repeatedly is try to take the short term gain, and when that fails, or gets exposed in the long term, he just lies about ever having said what he said, or doing what he did. The lies are always in the service of making him look better at that very moment.
A much more believable theory would have been if he actually was sick, and all of the other Republican lackeys were falling over around him, he would continue to claim he was well, despite being attached to an oxygen machine. And the Dinesh D’Souzas of the world would have claimed that every president in history had to use oxygen machines in order to function, and because it’s impossible to argue with that level of insanity, it would have blown over. Now that’s a lie I can see him going for.

515

Speaking of conspiracy theories, I have one of my own, which I saw only one other poster mention in this whole thread (I can’t find the post now).

I think Trump has known he was positive for COVID for longer than they admit. He only came out with the truth when the symptoms got so severe that they could no longer hide it. He must get tested every day, which would be easy to do as long as it’s not the brain stabber. To go from a positive test to hospitalization in less than 24 hours is fairly unlikely.

516

They’re going to admit the so-called president long before the point thay would admit you or me.

517

I wonder what Walter Reed can do that the White House cannot do. They must have a serious clinic there.

518

I agree with this with a slight tweak. I agree that he has known he was positive longer than we’ve been told. Which makes his mingling with staff and public inexcusable criminal.

But I honestly think he had some mild symptoms at first (stuff like scratchy throat, sniffles, mild fever) and tried to tell himself they were nothing, like anyone might do. “If I ignore them, they’ll go away, etc.” After all, he is a germophobe, so he probably figured those bad boys couldn’t touch him.

For a while the WH told the public he was getting tested every day, but yesterday on the radio someone specifically said he had NOT been getting tested every day. And anyway you can have the mild symptoms for a while before a test will show up positive.

So when he finally DID get tested and came up positive, then I’m on board with the rest of @Monocracy ‘s post. He still tried to hide the symptoms, assumed they would go away like many others’ have, and THEN when there was no way to hide it anymore, PLUS he seemed to be getting into real trouble-- time to go to hospital.

And I was speculating with a friend yesterday… if he were seriously, deathly, ill would he be a bombastic, arrogant, bastard of a patient, or would fear of imminent death turn him into a terrified, clingy, whiny baby in the hospital? Maybe some of the medicos here on the board can chime in on that question, since I’m assuming y’all have encountered cocky, blowhard male (let’s face it) patients who melted into blobs of compliant terror when they were staring the Grim Reaper in the face.

519

IANAD but I’d go with the blob option. Bombast is usually backed by some sort of credible threat - in his case “I’ll tie you up in court until you are broke”. I don’t care how many lawyers you have, you can’t sue your way out of illness.

520

Maybe trump the patient will turn out to be a

pussycat…meow

521

Right. With Trump you have to assume a lie is high probability. If he’s says anything without lying it’s still part of a bigger lie anyway. I don’t think he’s faking it, but we aren’t getting the whole truth either.

522

No, I’m not going to get over it - not when she, who most likely had an illegal status herself at one point, mocks the plight of migrants who weren’t as fortunate as she was to marry into wealth and power. She wants to be thought of as a First Lady, well she ain’t my first lady. She tears up Jackie O’s rose garden. She mocks the less fortunate. Fuck that. She needs to go back home to Slovenia.