Someone on another board has suggested that the island is an alien craft that crashed or landed a long time ago – long enough for dirt and sand and seeds and such to drift and pile up and build an island. Sorta like what Stephen King did in The Tommyknockers.
The things that made me believe it was a hallucination were, IIRC Boone was dozing off or unconscious when he then woke up and heard Shannon. Shortly after Locke left Boone we see him talking with Sayid. Was it possible that he could have had time to go back to the beach, grab Shannon and take her back and tie her up then head back to the beach to run into Sayid? It didn’t seem likely to me. Also, I wasn’t too sure if Shannon would willingly go with Locke without wanting to take someone else along, she seems too suspicious of him. Even if Locke said Boone was hurt and needed her, she’s not so stupid that she wouldn’t think they’d need to bring along either Jack to treat him or someone else to help carry Boone back. I can’t think of any other reason he would be able to use to lure her away and he certainly wouldn’t be able to drag her off unwillingly with all the other people around. Plus she is just not the type to wander off into the jungle by herself so that he could grab her. No, it just didn’t seem possible to me that he could have brought her out there.
For another thing, I don’t think Locke is that evil or works that way. The other people he has helped on their own journeys, Jack and Charlie, have had to do so by themselves. He offers a little advice, usually a little cryptic, and maybe a nudge but he knows they have to figure it out for himself. Somehow he knew Boone had a Shannon monkey on his back and he needed a stronger push in the right direction. Yes, I agree that Locke was sending him on a vision quest.
Re: Whether or not Boone and Shannon’s relationship was incestuous. A check of the dictionary lists incest as sexual intercourse between people who would not legally be allowed to marry. I don’t think there’s any law that says step-siblings cannot marry, there are only laws about close blood relatives marrying. Some people think it’s still squicky for kids raised together as siblings to get romantic, however I don’t see how it’s much different than childhood friends growing up together and ending up dating. There are people that are not going to watch the show now because they had their relationship be incestuous. That’s just ridiculous.
Jin - Yeah, he must speak English, too. I don’t see how someone who does not understand the language could understand other people so well. Example, when Hurley was babbling away and Jin wasn’t paying attention, then Hurley said “your wife is hot.” Jin looked up at him and it was like he thought for a moment and decided it wasn’t worth letting out his secret, did he actually smile and shake his head a little? (I need to watch this episode again!) I can’t wait for Jin’s backstory. It would be funny if he had been secretly learning English and had planned to run away with Jin to get away from her father.
One more thing, Boone said Shannon was “Special”, I thought that was really interesting because
[SPOILER]Next week’s episode is titled “Special” and it is indeed about Michael/Walt. Maybe that was a little foreshadowing?
I think there is also a little bit of a preview for the next episode or references back to the previous episode in some of the titles or comments made during episodes. For example the Tabula Rasa episode was about Kate and blank slates but the next episode was Locke’s episode and he was also starting over on the Island, plus the Tabula Rasa reference is related to John Locke the philosopher. I think there were other times I noticed this but I haven’t kept track … ah, another reason to rewatch everything.
Here’s another spiler about Sawyer. I heard that he was at the police station because he was in the “Incident at the bar” that involved Jack’s dad. Remember the guy at the hotel told Jack there was an incident at the bar? In the police station Sawyer yells, “he wanted his bottle back so I gave it to him!”. I guess he bashed him over the head. Boone certainly looked like he took a good look at Sawyer and that would also explain why he felt Sawyer was guilty of taking his sister’s meds. Perhaps he even commented on the police station incident when Sawyer caught him, which may have spurred an even worse beating from Sawyer?
[/SPOILER]
I am reposting this comment outside of the spoilers because it’s not really a spoiler although it relates to one. Maybe some of the non-spoiler readers may have some thoughts on this.
I think there is also a little bit of a preview for the next episode or references back to the previous episode in some of the titles or comments made during episodes. For example the Tabula Rasa episode was about Kate and blank slates but the next episode was Locke’s episode and he was also starting over on the Island, plus the Tabula Rasa reference is related to John Locke the philosopher. I think there were other times I noticed this but I haven’t kept track … ah, another reason to rewatch everything. 
I think I’m going to go with the theory that the island has the same properties as if you were dreaming.
If you don’t know your dreaming then you have nightmares about your fears. Jack has issues with his father and then he is suddenly living a nightmare chasing his father through the woods. Walt reads a comic book with a polar bear in it and later there’s a polar bear in the jungle.
But dreams also have the same property in that when you know it’s a dream, you can start controlling things yourself.
I think Locke was the first to figure this out, mainly because he could suddenly walk again. I heard it is common for people in wheelchairs to have dreams in which they can walk.
He has to now slowly convince people that what they fear is going to come to fruition but that they also need to realize that they can “will” things to happen.
The compass is a good example. If you were dreaming about using one it would be something you needed. If you realized it was a dream you’d find you don’t really need it since you could “will” your way around, like a lucid dream.
Locke may have figured this out, and it why he said he doesn’t need a compass anymore.
I think he used Boone as a test subject to reveal that 1) your nightmares will come into reality until you “let them go”, 2) that you can “will” things to happen, “you’ll be able to reach the knife when your motivated”, and 3) It may be dangerous to reveal these secrets to everyone since they could abuse the “willing things to happen” power.
Maybe Locke realizes “there is good and evil, dark and light” and some people are going to use their power for good, and some will use it for evil, and that will divide them, saying things like “we’re going to need Sayid on our side”.
I go back to the line Locke used after confronting the monster, “I looked this island in the eye and what I saw was beautiful.” Almost like figuring out your lucid dreaming in real life.
A couple quiries:
What is the connection with Locke telling Boone about Michelangelo and the block of Marble?( and Michelangelos father beating him etc)
Did Locke give Sayid his compass because he didn’t need it anymore or that he knew that there some sort of hinky properties on the island that makes the compass wrong and it would confuse the castaways?
It thought there were hinges on it, and a “ridge” around it.
It struck me as odd that he said it was concrete, because I thought i’d just seen hinges.
Also, when they first discovered it, it was by dropping a knife(?) on it, and I seem to recall a metallic clink. I thought that it indicated the hatch was steel, but I guess that could have been the knife on concrete, though, or from it hitting the “window”, or just a continuity error.
Eh, I guesss there was another comment in my spoiler that didn’t need to be spoilerized because it was part of this episode but it’s not a big deal so I’ll just leave it that way.
I remembered another thing I wanted to comment on.
Jack and Kate’s friendliness. Some people have been saying it didn’t ring true because they both should have been angry with each other. However I think it showed a true side of human nature. Sometimes people do that sort of thing when they both want to apologize and don’t have the guts to say it. Had Jack just wandered off when she saw him without saying anything or had Kate just ignored him then they both would have known that neither was ready to apologize. Instead they both made polite but friendly conversation without actually talking about the elephant in the room… er, jungle. To me that was much more real life. We humans just aren’t very good at admitting we were wrong or apologizing. Sometimes it goes unsaid but is basically mutually understood. Very subtle but very well-done, IMO.
I’m pretty sure he said it was “sealed” with concrete - that is, concrete was in the spaces made by the metal door and doorjamb, making a visible ridge, but maybe a Tivoer can look it up for us.
If so, it would seem to indicate that it was once meant to open, but not anymore. Perhaps sealed by Ethan or Rousseau to keep people out? Or by the French woman to keep Rousseau in? Or by hyper-intelligent polar bears?
Hmmm…this might tail into the whole “island-is-a-spaceship” idea that someone else mentioned. Maybe someone left the Holodeck running…
Good episode. Finally back on track. The episode WAS a little stilted because my two year old is going through potty training and we had to pause every few minutes for “poo-poo”, but that really is not related to the show…
A few random thoughts:
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WAG- The TCM is some sort of giant wasp or bee. When that thing shot out of the ground, it reminded me of when the bees in the underground hive attacked Charlie. It seemed to be flying. And perhaps that stuff that Locke was using to put on Boone’s head was really the Queen’s royal jelly or honey (Think “Futurama!”). Maybe the island is some kind of (metal?) hive.
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Whatever that stuff is, I think it is what turned the “others.”
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Anyone else get an Empire Strikes Back vibe from the vision quest? I half expected the TCM to have Boone’s face when it killed Shannon.
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Locke and the Comapss- Another possibility is that he sabotaged it (not that he just knew it wouldn’t work) so Sayid couldn’t navigate the island. At that point, Sayid and Jack began to look at Locke with suspicion. Can you damage a compass in such a way? Why would they look at him with suspicion after that? He SEEMED (from their perspective) to be helpful.
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I really don’t look at Locke as shady. For all we know, his way is correct. Eats_Crayons compares his behavior to Ethan’s. That got me thinking that MAYBE Ethan isn’t a bad guy at all (we talked about this possibility before.)
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I also began to wonder if Jin speaks English as well. His character is really developing a little bit. I enjoy watching him. The actor who plays him (who also had a small role in Spiderman 2, where he speaks English like a Californian) does a great job of developing a character without speaking a word of English.
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Shadowfax33- Your 11 year old probably doesn’t enjoy seeing Shannon in a bikini as much as the rest of us.
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I think it was almost certain that Locke had a vision quest. I suspect it entailed him becoming the great hunter, giving him strength to kill the boar.
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I love that Jack is addicted to Kate. He KNOWS he shouldn’t trust her. He knows she can play him. But he can’t help it! And I get it. She is CHARMING!
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One other thing about Jack, Mathew Fox plays him with a LOT of head shaking and nodding. Jack is basically a bobble head doll.
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When Hurley told Jin to pee on it, I couldn’t help but think of Friends, not Survivor.
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Anyone get a good grasp on what Sawyer was saying in the police station. Something about “her” and possibly “I bought it.” His last line about getting his side of the story was clear, but the back ground ones were a little low. I assume he has been arrested for conning another woman.
On a more prosaic note: what’s the point in building a garden when all you can plant is the same stuff that grows wild around you? So they have a neat little plot of ground with a mango tree in it. Surrounded by thousands of mango trees.
Tivo cut me off right after the “follow me” line. But it looks like all I missed was the peview of next week.
Re: the “concrete” comment. Possibly it is a metal door set into a concrete structure. From what I saw, it was about 3 ft. square, with a small glass window, a long hinge-looking thing on one side, and no visible handle or latch (I agree that it probably opens from the inside). It looked like painted metal, and the structure it’s attached to looks like it’s the same material, but it could just be painted the same. Also the structure curves down under the jungle floor (how could it have taken them days to excavate it only that far?)
I noticed at the beginning of the episode, someone mentioned that Michael had somehow found his own bag after all this time. Maybe Walt’s luck is rubbing off on him.
He said it was sealed with or maybe in, concrete, not that it was concrete. Which would explain why they haven’t already tried simply prying it open with something.
If it’s a hatch of a pressurised airplane, the hatch would first open in, then out. At least that how I’ve seen it on the planes I’ve flown in.
I thought at some point someone had said the hatch had been sealed with concrete… I think it was Boone when he was asking how they’d manage to get it open.
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I was right on time, I see.
:smack:
This was only my second episode and the whole hallucination thing may have lost (pun intended) me as a viewer. Hallucination/dreams are a writer’s biggest cop-out.
Normally, I would just agree with you. But in this ep, the spirit vision quest actually helps move the entire storyline, not just this one ep. It fits with what we know (or suspect) about the Island and Locke.
Good episode! Some comments:
They still seem strangely unconcerned about Claire. Remember, there are some 40-odd people on the island, not just the few we see every week. Seems like SOME of them should be organized into a search detail of some sort. Or how about a group going back to find Rousseau? She may be nuts, but she’s been there 16 years at least and has to be holding some clues.
Boone and Shannon are step-siblings. No surprise there. That’s what I expected to see. Shannon has been scamming Boone for money. I didn’t expect that, but it’s in keeping with her character. She uses others to get what she wants. A glimpse of Sawyer being thrown in the pokey! I agree that he probably got into a fight with Jack’s dad, but if he was a murder suspect, why would he be able to get on a plane leaving Australia-- is he on the run now, like Kate…?
Hurley is a riot! He must’ve seen the “Friends” episode where Rachel (?) gets stung by something at the beach. “Your wife is hot.” He continues to crack me up. Can’t wait to see his backstory.
Boone and Locke have been going to there secret spot for several days, and all they’ve done is clear the dirt away from about 4 ft around the hatch thing? Hmmm… It looks awefully earth-like, if you know what I mean, to be a spacecraft.
The monster is back! I’m pretty sure I’ve never heard it sound like it was taking giant steps before. It always sounded like it was moving thru the jungle smoothely. But it sure looks like Boone got a good gander at it. He and Locke are the only ones.
Locke gives Boone a lesson. He had to be planning it all along since he was preparing the hallucinogen/anticeptic goo all along. What would he have done if Boone didn’t say he was going to tell Shannon? And note that he said the others weren’t “ready” yet. Go back to what Rousseau told Sayid-- one by one, her shipmates became “lost”, and it would happen to Sayid’s group as well. I still think all that stuff she told Sayid is KEY, KEY, KEY, to the whole story.
Boone hears Shannon screaming, and it turns out she’s tied up nearby. I gotta say, my first thought was-- that’s not really her. I told my LOST group that she’d still be back at camp. Boone is now in Locke’s world!!
Is Locke good or evil? I go back to Claire’s dream sequence, where Locke had one black eye and one white eye. That tells me he is either BOTH good AND evil or NEITHER good NOR evil. He is absolutely in tune with the island, though.
Next week-- polar bears!! Can’t wait.
It didn’t look to me like they’d excavated much. They’d probably taken a couple whacks at it with the ax, because Boone said the glass wouldn’t break. But that’s it. Just what have Locke & Boone been doing there together for the last four days? Locke I believe could sit there four days just contemplating it, but Boone is young & impatient. No way he’s been just sitting there all day, for four days.
Anyway, are there any herbalists in the audience? What was the hallucinogen that Locke could have used on Boone? I’m not aware of anything that would do that, certainly not by just being applied to an open wound. Nor would anything I know about cause such a clean, complete hallucination. Drug trips don’t work quite like that, do they?
I think the island is solely responsible for the hallucination, and that paste Locke applied to Boone’s wound was just what he said, to stop infection. I think all you need for a hallucination on that island is to be out in the jungle by yourself, have a personal problem you’re dealing with, and be under stress. All of which Locke supplied.
Because if they are there long enough and using up their resources (cutting down mango tress for firewood etc.) they are going to need to replenish. May as well start now, since trees take awhile. Then too things will be a bit more localized. Get a grove or orchard of trees set up without as many weeds etc. and it will be easier to get at the fruits rather than “foraging” for food hunter-gatherer style.
Made sense to me.
I hsould have chosen my words more carefully when I implied Locke might not be a “good guy”. I didn’t mean it as if he was a “bad guy” in the “evil” sense but rather as “Good Guy Tribe = our castaways” and the then there are the Others (MIPUMS, mysterious island persons of unknown motives). And Locke is behanving more like them.
Ethan seemed really passionate as if there was some tremensoudly important higher purpose – a purpose for which it is acceptable to sacrifice some people. In the time he was with our castaways, he could have slit any number of people’s throats while they slept if he was actually “evil”. Instead Ethan seemed to have an agenda that was really important and fairly specific.
Locke is also getting that way – the hatch is of paramount importance, the island can give you “gifts” if you can follow the right path… Like the Island is seducing him. Locke is starting to act as if the Island s more important than the castaways. Whether the Island is a good thing or an evil thing, we don’t know. So far Locke feels that it can free you (and the Island is a key to some higher purpose or salvation). But it’s kind of like playing with a Ouija board, you don’t really know what kind of powers you’re messing with even if you get answers you like or need.
Opening that hatch may be a Pandora’s Box. Locke is behaving like it’s a Mystical Good Thing, but what if he’s wrong? And like WhyNot said, it’s one thing to guide someone to a better place when they ask for it, and damn creepy when they hit you on the head, tie you up and force salvation on you.
Herbalist here. Yes, there are plenty of herbs that could produce such an effect, and lots of them (a disporportionate number, actually) are jungle plants. I’m more familiar with western herbs than Amazon herbs, but if I were to make a (legal but very unsafe) product, I’d go with datura, mandrake, wormwood or thuja. There are hundreds of others. Many of them require multiple plants to be smashed together in very specific quantities in very specific formulas. There’s one my teacher used in the Amazon which was 5 different plants, and each one alone did nothing. Only when combined did the chemicals interect in such a way as to produce the proper alkaloids for hallucination.
Then there’s the ones we all know about, like psilopsybin, peyote and the one I can’t spell but sounds like “iowasca”.
“Drug trips” for recreation don’t often produce clean, linear hallucinations quite like that. But for some reason, hallucinogens used in ceremony, such as vision quests, often do.