[sub]Wives, would this be an insulting conversation to start?[/sub]
I’m not a wife, but:
The question is pointless. There is NO WAY that either one of you can state with any certainty what your feelings will be five, ten, or fifteen years down the road. Unexpected things can happen.
That question is a bomb, and I wouldn’t set it off when there’s nothing that can result except a nasty explosion.
I think those are very good conversations to have, but they aren’t a conversation about whether I’m sure our marriage would last the 18 years. I’d probably feel a lot of things if my husband asked me that question. My first feeling would be that he’s not sure. I would then have the related questions “How could I not know that he was uncertain?”, and " How could he not know I was sure ( or at least I was until he asked me this question)?"
And you won’t even come close to getting a guarantee - I don’t imagine anyone would say on their wedding day that they expect to get divorced, but yet people do.
So you don’t want kids? You don’t want your wife? Or both?
This is pretty nasty but: are you going to be honest and tell the kid he/she broke up the marriage when it comes to that?
Count me as another who would immediately worry that you yourself weren’t sure we’d be staying together.
But on top of that, I just don’t feel like people should be making definite statements about how they will or won’t feel in the future. Yes, educated guesses (and marriage is nothing if not an educated guess that you will love someone else for a long, long time), but to expect someone to say, “Yes, we will to be together 18 years from now” is just not reasonable. At least, were I married, I would feel uncomfortable saying so to my husband NO MATTER how much I loved him and NO MATTER how firm a belief I had in our marriage’s staying power. And if he felt an answer in the affirmative was necessary for us to have children, well, we wouldn’t be having children.
Not to speak for Fiveyearlurker, but I think he wants both kids and his wife, but he wants to have a potentially tricky conversation with her about the stability of their future for their possible kids’ sake.
To Fiveyearlurker: I don’t think the question is unreasonable, or unfair. I think it is something that if you are uncomfortable about, you should be able to bring it up. However, I still (for the third time!) advise caution, because not everyone will take it well, whether they’re being unreasonable or not. I would ask questions if I were the wife in the scenario, so I think you should be ready to answer a few before getting an answer to your own, just in case she needs that kind of reassurance. But I don’t know her or how she would react. She might clam up and give you the cold shoulder, or perhaps she’d yell at you for a week straight, or maybe she’d settle for something in the middle - or, she might just say “I’ve been thinking the same thing.” Only you will be the best judge as to how she may react. But, speaking as a woman, be careful. We’ve been sometimes known to be a little volatile on occasion. 
But I jest; I’m painting with a large brush. If it’s something that’s burning in your mind, communication is a must. I can’t give you suggestions for how to bring it up to her (except that it won’t happen in casual conversation), since I don’t know her or her attitude, personality, etc.
One thing I’ve been thinking about, though, if you don’t mind my asking: What is it exactly that you hope to get out of this conversation? You already say you understand that there are no guarantees, so that’s good. I’m not trying to be snarky or anything, I’m just curious. It might help in our answers to your question.
And upon rereading I find that John Carter said it all much more concisely than I did.
Well, for all of you women out there with the “My box-My choice” attitude, deal with it if your gonna be selfish and try to force parenthood on someone.
Fiveyearlurker–It might be best for both of you if you figure out what, specifically, you’re afraid of, here. Then you could phrase your concerns in a way that doesn’t imply that the marriage itself is unstable, but that you’re a bit worried about somewhat more specific changes to a relationship that come with having children.
For example–Do you think that the stress and the unromantic realities of family life will put out the spark you guys have with each other? In that case, you might want to say something like, “We’ll have to find ways to make time to be together and keep our romance going. We can’t let the daily details and frenetic rushing around of family life get in the way of that. How should we address that?”
Do your concerns really have to do with having kids, or do you think there’s a problem with the marriage itself? If you really don’t feel that you love each other enough to pull together when things get tough–like, if the kids get sick, if one of you loses your job, etc.–then you’ve got doubts about your marriage that really have nothing to do with the kids. If you think that your wife might make a lousy mother, or that you might make a lousy father–once again, that’s something that really doesn’t have to do with having kids. It’s got much more to do with the kinds of respect or esteem you have for each other to start with.
Then again, IANAWife. I’ve never been married. So maybe I have no idea what I’m talking about.
I’m very old-fashioned about marriage which may be why I haven’t done it yet. You see, to me, the time to bring up the idea of whether you’re ready to make an 18 year committment to bringing up a child is one which should be raised before the marriage. Yes, I know things change. Three years ago, I would have sworn two friends’ marriage of nearly 30 years was rock steady, in fact, I think I did. A year ago, he turned up on my couch after his wife kicked him out. On the other hand, I wouldn’t go into a marriage if I didn’t think we’d remain married to each other for the rest of our lives and whether kids will be part of that is something that needs to be settled long before a caterer’s picked.
That said, I tend to be analytical myself and raising a kid or kids is a long-term commitment which does change things. I’d ask the question, trying to look realistically at what might change. Assure your wife it’s not that you’ll love her less or that you’re questioning your marriage, but that you’re sure you don’t want to get in over your head and you want to make sure you do right by your child or children as well as each other. The question would bother me, but I could see why it was being asked.
Ultimately, though, you know your wife best, or I hope you do. You’ve been given some reasons why the question might bother her; only you know whether they apply.
Good luck,
CJ
I can’t imagine my husband asking this, but then he knows that our marriage is until death do us part. Such a question would make me wonder about his commitment. He was also the one wanting kids NOW from the beginning.
I did once title a sketch of him “My first Husband” because it was my first sketch of him and he was annoying the hell out of me during it.
I’m sorry, but when I read this I couldn’t help but picture you and your wife as jugglers- juggling pins or something when suddenly you pick up an anvil and chuck it at her. She dodges it ( or catches it and staggers around) and stares at you while the rest of the items you were juggling tumble around you on the floor. I just don’t see how this would come up gracefully in conversation.
On the other hand, if you are really worried about the future and the committment that eighteen years means and it’s more than just a vague generic “nobody knows what the future will bring” this may be a conversation you should have.
I’m just a little concerned that if my hypothetical husband tried to start this kind of a conversation I’d be wondering whether he was feeling that divorce was inevitable and we should just get it over with now–not wait eighteen years.
Then again I’m not married, never been married, and am old enough that waiting seven years to have children could seriously negatively impact my fertility–so I’d be more likely to find myself pregnant before I’d adjusted to being married than in your shoes.
it would depend on how you bring it up.
like scribble, i think if you bring it up in the context of how will a child impact our relationship, you may get away with it.
i have seen things go south in a marriage when one partner or the other puts being a parent ahead of all else.
you may want to see how your spouse sees the parent role, spouse role, and how to maintain a balance so the child feels secure and sees a strong marriage.
You know, this isn’t an all (Are you going to flake on me in the next 18 years?) or nothing (Let us never speak of this again.) concept. You simply need to reframe it so your wife doesn’t feel threatened or insecure.
Try this:
Instead of saying “will you still be here in 18 years”, mention that with childrearing being a very stressful occupation, you want to make sure that any underlying problems are dealt with before the blitz begins. Can she think of anything that’s been bothering her and could turn into a big problem? Would she like to work on it now or think about it for a while? Are there any problems that are bugging you that might explode? Do you want to work on it now or think about it for a while? Think of it as a marriage tune-up, not a long-term forecast for marriage death.
And while you’re at it, you guy you, try telling your wife that you love her and look forward to the next umpteen years with her.
I’m with others in being confused about what it is exactly that you’re looking for from this conversation. You say you’re not looking for guarantees, which is good, because nobody can give that kind of guarantee. I married my husband with the promise that we’d be together as long as we both shall live, and I meant that, but can I predict what’s going to happen in the future? No.
So, while I wouldn’t be insulted by such a question, I would be very puzzled by it. I gave my word, what more can I give to assure that I’ll stay? I do think that conversations about how you anticipate children to change your marriage are very good, because they most definitely will, but I really don’t understand the point of, “Before we have kids, will you be sticking around?”
As phrased, it sounds like a very loaded question and your wife may not take it so well. It’s along the lines of “Do you still beat your wife?”.
What were your marriage vows?..only for 17 years? Wha?
No one can guarantee that they’ll still be there in 18 years. And frankly, if you’re thinking that it’s important in that sense, then perhaps you should rethink having children.
Children are smart cookies and yes, they do best in a stable two-parent household. But if your relationship goes sour say in 12 years, do you think that the kids will be better off if you “stay together for the children”? Children will thrive in a loving household. Period.
Long rant short, what benefit would posing this question have? Seems you have a lot more to lose than gain by asking this one.
I think a lot will depend on how you bring it up - DH freaked me right the hell out when we were engaged. He was in Gulf War I and apparently one of his friends (X) had started cheating on his wife (Y), with whom I was semi-friendly before they let, and had gotten to be pretty good friends with while they were gone.
DH would send these letters with musings about infidelity, reactions to it, etc., because he didn’t want to come right out and tell me about X since he didn’t know how much Y knew about it (they’d been having problems before the unit left, so there was the possibility she knew, but…). I was a basket case until X told Y and everyone could speak freely, because I had no idea what was going on in DH’s head.
At least in your case you’ll be right there and if you say something that hits her wrong, she can ask “WTF?” and not have to wait 3 weeks to a month for the next letter to come with an answer!
I think it might be better to reaffirm than to question – as others have said, I’d be surprised and concerned about what’s going on in my husband’s mind if he asked me such a question.
I think a better way to do it would be to say something along the lines of, “I love you and I think things are great between us now, but I know that having kids can put a lot of stress on a marriage. I want you to know that whatever comes up, I will do my part in anything we can do to keep our relationship healthy and happy, so that our kids (and grandkids) have two parents who love each other all their growing-up years and beyond.”
If my husband said something like that, I would be glad that he had not only thought about it, but was certain in his committment to me and to our future family. I would be inclined to respond in kind (assuming I felt the same way). If she doesn’t naturally respond that way, you might get away with asking if she feels the same, even if that includes whatever measures you haven’t had to take until now (for my hubby and me, that would be therapy/counseling, for a start). I don’t think I would be offended if it were put into that context.
Also, if you do have friends who are getting divorced, you might say that that’s what made you think of it – make it clear that you’re not really questioning either of your committment to each other, just that this sort of thing has been on your mind, and since you’re thinking about having a baby, you want to make sure you’re both happy.
Do be careful. Your wife knows you and may see right through any phrasing to the original question as you phrased it here.