Well, if the beard is glued on, it’s probably Buddha disguised as St. Peter. If it’s powdered like Caesar Romero, it’s probably St. Peter disguised as Buddha. Simple, innit?
For me the point is admitting that I don’t know If I missed your point feel free to elaborate.
AS I said, this is only entertainment.
hmmm… I’m not about to go into any of the other threads, I often only read these threads to wath folks like bibleMan get trounced by logic… but the two quotes above attributed to bibleman make me wonder if he is not reprentative of a very specific “christian” org…
Do the numbers 607, 1914, 1975 mean anything to him?
Do the Names Russell, Rutherford, Franz, Herschell mean anything to him?
Becuase of all the arrogant ‘christian’ denominoations I have had the dis-pleasure of debating bible topics with, theirs is the most argumentative, arrogant of them all, and they don’t even study the bible, but instead publications from their ‘group’ about bible topics.
They are the worst at pulling scripture references from one spot and manipulating them to fit an agenda… Hell, in the 125+ years of this groups existance, there is a few scriptures they refuse to discuss (Christ’s ‘own’ words, even), and the one time they did approach the scripture I have in mind, was in 195x and it was to admonish other groups (IIRC, the group they are technically an offshoot of that still exists to this day) about doing the things they themselves do EVERY DAMN DAY.
I can expound upon this, but I fear I have already hijacked enough…
No, you have NOT hijacked enough.
::showering simster with holy water::
Expound! The power of Christ compels you!
He is referring to the Jehovah’s Witnesses.
I suspect that he may be mistaken. I would think the Bible man would display the exact same personality traits if he were a liberal Episcopalian or a UU. (He may, indeed, be JW, I just don’t get the feeling that that is the source of his personality. And I don’t recall the JW folks I’ve met talking as much about salvation as Bible man does; they tend to expect a new creation in the physical world while he hangs out in what he perceives to be the spiritual. OTOH, his claims that all Scripture is internally consistent are, themselves, consistent with JW belief.)
Yes, but if I admit I know that I don’t get to make my Power of Christ joke. Where’s your priorities, man?
I used to work with and was reasonably good friends with a few Jehovah’s witnesses. None were as, ah, strident as Bible Man, though I fear a few did have the same casual relationship with logic he shows. Which only goes to show that logic is not something you want to have a one-night stand with; you need an ongoing committed relationship, not merely a blow job in a dirty motel room.
Having read the thread in question, I think it’s safe to say that Bible Man is dumb.
That’s all.
Xander Harris! When did YOU join the Dope? How’s the eye, and did you ever boink Willow?
To link to a single post, you find the post you want to link to, click on th post # in the upper right corner. That will open the post in a new window. Then just link to that url like you’d normally link to a page.
You are correct, that is the group that I am reffering to.
From the one quote above attributed to bibleman, about the lack of hell, while not unique to the JW, it is one of their grander speaking points…
As for the JW view of Salvation, they believe in 2 distinct classes, the 144,000 annoited ones and the ‘other sheep’… the 144,000 are given a spiritual resurection to rule with Christ himself, while the others are given a ‘paradise on earth’ after the great tribulation… they don’t believe in Hell, and the timing of your death (before or during the ‘great tribulation’) determines your status (to some degree) in the ‘new world’. They’ve flipped their interpetations here a number of times…
Russel was the founder of the original organization (The Bible Students), Rutherford took over after his death, a split ensued, and the organization later became known as the “Jehovah’s Witnesses”… Franz was the next President and I think Herschell is the current.
607 - the year they claim Jeruselum was destroyed… Important because it lays the foundation for thier entire “end times” chronology… with it you get to 1914 (Christ’s return to the throne) and then on to 1975 (end of 6000 years of creation and one of many failed predictions for the end of the world to begin.) Of course, modern archeology has pointed to Jeruselems destruction in 586/7… a point they will readily argue… Even their own internal publications can be used to ‘prove’ that the destruction is in 586/7…
As for the scripture that I refer to…
Luke 21:8 says:
1.) The JW (beyond any doubt) claim that they alone are gods ‘spirit directed organization on earth’, and that Christ has ruled ‘invisibly’ in heaven since his return in 1914 ** They also teach that Christ/Jehovah specifically chose thier group in 1917/1918… Since they claim to be God’s Visible Organization, and that they have an annoited class that gets info directly from God Himself, I feel that qualifes them for the “I am he” clause.
2.) Thier original teachings were contained in a series of books, "Studies In Scripture’… there were 6 books written by Russel (7 if you account for the “Finished Mystery” Published after his death)… Book 3 was handily titled “The Time of the end is at hand”… suffice clause 2 of Christ’s words about what to avoid…
Of course, if you bring that up to them, they will say that Christ was not reffering to ‘them’, as they are special.
There are other scriptures that say who to avoid, one that I can never remember that says to avoid the ones that say “there he is, in the secret place” that can also show that what they teach is in-congruant with honest biblical knowledge. (whatever that means).
Why is this scripture so damning? If you use their own publications Indexes and CD to search for it, you will only find it referenced in a grouping (ie - Luke 21:1-15 or somethng like that)… and only once, in 195x, (for 20 minutes I think) was the scripture actually discussed in one of thier publications, and then, as I said earlier, it was used as an attack against others…
The original ‘Studies in Scriptures’ was touted as the ‘Bible topically arranged’ and the only proper way to study the bible… in fact, it was so good that it was also stated that if you failed to use the publication, and only the bible, that you would quickly fall into darkness…
** Interesting to note that originally (under Pastor Russel) they believed that Christ’s return was in 1874, and taht the ‘time of the end’ would be 1914 (not the beginning of the last days, but the last of the last days)… also, originally the return in 1874 was to be a physical one, when that didn’t happen, they quickly (well, it took a little while) realized it must have been a ‘spiritual’ return.
I knew I forgot a paragraph…
Another point of the Luke21:8 ommission is that they use the scriptures directly before (21:7) and after (21:9+) as one of theire proofs that we are in the “last days”…
Also, while they carry a bible (thier own translation effort… a whole nother topic), and seem to have alot of it memorized, it isn;t thru traditional study efforts… all of their knowledge is fed to them by the “Faithful and Discreet Slave” thru the publications… and whatever the current pub says is the correct understanding is what they believe, irregaurdless of what a past (or future) pub might say about the same thing.
Also, this is an indictment not of the people themselves, but of the organization/religion that they belong too… most/all of the JW followers are good honest folk… just very well indoctrinated into the teachings.
And now I introduce you to my favorite Bible man argument, the appeal to idiocy…
And that’s why we’re here folks. Muted applause only, please.
*Duck, Duck, Duck, Duck, Duck, Duck, Duck, Goose, Duck, Duck, Duck, Aneurysm
Fuck logic, it followed Duck, didn’t it?
Actually, I toyed with the idea of contesting your position on this point in the previous thread, but deemed it nothing but a distraction from the point at hand. This thread, though, has no point, so…
Your post is a part of this board, and so has something to do with the messageboard in aggregate. Period. You post count is, of course, irrelevent; at best the mods represent the message boards more than others, but everybody else is equally capable of making this board seem unfriendly and aggressive.
That’s the ‘logically’ part; the ‘not’ part is that your confrontational tone would makes your post more memorable, and thus more seemingly reflectional of the board, based on purely emotional reaction.
Now, this doesn’t mean that Bible man is doing anything close to reasonable debate. But really, if you want to throw stones, you should first verify the opacity of your residence…
Well, of course it has no point. Look who started it!
Well, okay, this thread had a point at the start, but it’s not like Bible man ever came in here and validated the thread’s existence. Of course, since he stated he thought he already was in GD, perhaps he thought he already had replied to you…
Doh! He stated he already thought he was in HERE. Now I’m getting confused… :smack:
Granted.
However, i am hardly a representative sample.
Also, we’ve now established that he likely doesn’t have much interested in logical debate and only interested in witnessing and obfusification.
C’MON, PEOPLE! Now you get all reasonable without A SINGLE OUNCE OF VITRIOL IN THE PIT!!!
I am rarely granted with proper vitriol. It’s a personal failing of mine. I blasted Bible man in a fit of frustration that is not indicative of my usual behaviour.
Sorry bro, poke another bear. 
Careful. If you stay confused long enough you start believing in Biblical literalism.