24: Season 5: Episode 17 (11:00pm - 12:00midnight)

So, wait, did the Prez not know Walt was in on it? That’s ridiculous - if the president is involved in a conspiracy, he’d want to know what other high government officials were involved. It makes some sense that Walt wouldn’t be told the President’s part, so he wouldn’t be able to implicate him. But he didn’t reveal his role to Walt even when he agreed to go ahead with the plan - what explains that? Had the plan worked, he would have been in the clear. Had the plan failed, he would have ended up out of office and in jail on treason charges whether he had signed on on Day 5 or months earlier. I simply don’t see an explanation for his behavior with Walt.

That’s the trouble with the way the show works - I bet rewatching with the knowledge of what the President was up to would reveal a ton more conspiracies.

It’s funny how much the overall arc of the seasons matches up, though. I just rented and watched Day 2. Let’s see - sixteen hours or so finding the huge weapon and getting rid of it. In this phase, Jack operates with full support from CTU and the government. Later on, the problem is apparently over, but for the last eight hours Jack ends up alone, operating against the government’s wishes, to bring down the cabal of high government officials and terrorist groups behind it all. The government officials always believed they were doing the right thing - there was supposed to be some sort of secret plan that would make sure the item never actually did any damage - but the terrorists screwed them over. Jack gets help from a few friends in CTU while the workers there are replaced with ones from outside, up until his friends are all arrested and then he operates alone.

It’s really very formulaic, actually. Day 3 worked approximately this way too; I don’t remember Day 4 well enough to know whether it fits into this basic schema. Given how they have the basic skeleton of the plot worked out in advance, you’d think they’d be able to plan ahead well enough to avoid major inconsistencies.

A ton more inconsistencies, that is.

No – the implication I got from the Henderson/Logan recording is that they both knew that Walt was involved – and that Walt thought that he was heading up the government angle of things. i.e. Walt didn’t know that Logan was involved, but Logan knew that Walt WAS. And Logan was letting Walt think that. So that would seem to mean that Logan was “playing along” when Walt came to him with the info about his role in the nerve gas plot, pretending to be hearing of it for the first time.

Don’t know – but he seemed to be swayed pretty quickly by Walt’s explanation, into going along with it. With what we know now, it’s apparently what he wanted in the first place. But perhaps he didn’t reveal his role to maintain his own plausible deniability. Keeping his options open.

However, I still rememeber thinking at the time that this wasn’t so different from what Jack and Tony were doing at the start of season 3, just on a larger scale. After all, Jack and Tony and Gael had secretly planned to bust Ramon Salazar out of prison for the express purpose of getting Jack re-established undercover with the Salazars. That whole operation resulted in a number of deaths, including Russian Roulette Guard at the prison. How’s that so different from Logan and Walt planning this secret operation to attempt to eradicate the Russian terror cell?

Oh yeah, it’s okay when Jack does it, because it worked… :wink:

More or less matches up closely with the time frame of Season 2, except that it wasn’t govt officials in season 2 who thought they were doing right. It was some corporate evil guy who was trying to start a war to drive oil prices up for his own gains.

Most of the seasons seem to have split into what I would consider two major “Acts”. Season 2, Act 1 was the nuclear bomb, resolved in hour 15. Act 2 was the “prevent the war” plot. This season, the time frame matches up exactly – Act 1 (“Stop the nerve gas threat”) ended with the gas plant blowing up, in hour 15. Act 2 appears to be expose the presidential conspiracy.

But as far as what part Jack has to go “rogue” in – there’s always some of that every season, but it’s not so much the same that it’s always in the same part, or for the same reason. He’s already gone rogue a few times today, when Lynn McGill was being an asswipe.

I think the explanations this season have been more consistent than they have sometimes been in the past. Even with the Logan “twist”, I can see that they are trying to tie up the awkward questions – the info in tonight’s episode tells me:

  1. Logan didn’t intend the attacks on American soil. He was tyring to accomplish the same thing Walt was.
  2. Logan did know about Walt, but Walt didn’t know about Logan.

There are probably still some loose ends, but the writers this season appear to be making more of an effort to tie them up than, for example, last season. I was worried earlier on that Palmer’s assassination would end up being a throwaway after Jack found the info on his computer – like a more full reason (what specifically did David know, who knew that he knew, etc) would never be addressed. I’m glad to see they came back to it.

As a rider to what I just wrote, let me say also that I don’t particularly believe that they intended Logan to be the bad guy from the start. The writers for this snow in the past have typically planned out SOME, but not ALL, of the plot in advance, even in later seasons. So I think they originally left it open that the Vice Prez could indeed have been the bad guy, if they chose to go that route.

Reminds me of Season 1 – I doubt they had decided that Nina would be the mole when the show started – they left it open where they could have made it a number of others.

I think that they probaby are plotting out most of “Act 1” at the start of the season (at least for seasons 4 and 5, once they went to the “air them all in consecutive weeks starting in Jan” format), but I’d guess that “Act 2” is not quite decided on or fleshed out yet.

Jack needs to go see Mr. Universe.

I don’t see why people are saying the interactions between Walt and Logan at the start of this season don’t make anys sense given our new info. It’s quite simple. Logan worked with Henderson to make this threat, and the somehow Henderson worked with Walt in a way that made Walt think he was in charge/the mastermind. When Logan “found out” that Walt was involved, he just pretended not to know Walt had anything to do with it. It’s fully possible that had the plan fully worked (ie, the gas got out of the US) that Logan might have told Walt he was in on the plan the whole time. But once things got FUBAR, he let Walt take the fall (though I’m sure he didn’t think he’d kill himself.)

What was that cheesey music in the last few minutes? I felt like I was watching some spoof or “24”.

Anyone notice the safe deposit box number: 23. I wonder if the writers did that as a joke.

I fully expected Heller to say he could be at the airport in 10 minutes. He needs to get with the program.

Banker guy, we hardly knew ye.

I was thinking something similar. Make a copy of the recording to your PDA and email it to Audrey. Blind copy Chloe and your own email address, maybe Wayne Palmer, too, and you’ve got several copies other than the one in your pocket.

I was also thinking, not enough presidents hold press conferences at 2:30 AM Eastern time.

Ah, Hack Bauer. You were in fine form tonight.

Nah, just share it out on Kazaa or other P2P as “bewbies.avi”… now you have backups all over the world. :slight_smile:

You have some good points about Season 2 being a lot like Season 5, but Season 3 is actually more consistant. Jack spends the entire day trying to stop the virus, and any conspiracies are on Jack and Tony’s part.

They do switch villians at pretty much the halfway point though.

Good episode, though I worry that Jack is going to have the army hot on his trail early in the next episode.

And I get the idea that Gardener is definatly not in on the Evil Nerve Gas Plot, which means he could be a good ally for jack. Having Heller on their side will help too, particulary if he can call the army off Jack for a while.

OK, my DVR garbled the recording this week. Does anyone know if and when these things are encored on cable?

Yeah, if I’m not mistaken, they didn’t decide until near the end of the season that Nina was going to be a bad guy. That explains why she still stood by Jack and helped him out in the beginning while no one was watching - something that she could have used to just kill Jack and be done with it. When you watch it back now, some of the stuff she did just doesn’t add up to her being a bad guy …because she wasn’t until the end.

Damned straight.

Some other thoughts:

How is it that Jack, Wayne, and Bank Guy have to abandon their car and sneak up to the bank, but RoboCop’s henchpersons can just cruise on up?

Don’t the police usually send more than one car to a bank alarm going off? And why not wait a little longer inside the bank before making a run for it? Cleary RoboCop doesn’t want Jack taken in by the police, but the Army just took out all the bad guys. Come out with your hands up and say “I’m Jack Bauer, you have a warrant for my arrest. Take me to your leader. By the way, I kidnapped these two people, you should let them go”, and send Wayne off with the recording. It’s not like he (Wayne) can’t call Audrey so she can have her dad stop by the motel. I don’t think that the cops and the Army will be leaving any time soon, so he’d be safe….

RoboTerrorist had a yellow card on his dash that was some type of curfew license thingie.

I’m glad the writers are trying to tie up some lose ends… but … how did Henderson know that Jack was alive, in order to frame him for Palmer’s murder? And how did he know that Toney, Michelle and Chloe knew about it? Logan and Cummings both thought Jack was dead.

Where’s Novick? Did he go to bed?

Where’s Curtis? Did he get released when Homeland Security took over?

So let me see if I have this straight. White House Aide woman managed to tape an incriminating conversation. An incredibly incriminating conversation. Slipped out (somehow) and put it in her safe deposit box. Ok…so far, so good.

The bad guys found about it.  (How?)    Kidnapped her daughter and said "Bring us the evidence."     Even though the evidence was locked in a safe deposit box and totally inaccessible.     Which you figure she had to have told them.    So the whole shootout at the gritty industrial complex makes no sense.   If it weren't for the whole "24" conceit, everyone could have had a good night's sleep.

It’s good to know that Jack, even after 17 hours of being beaten, gassed, blowed up, tasered and chased still can fire a pistol while on the run more accurately than bad guys can fire automatic weapons.

The body count of innocents was pretty high this episode. Two EMTs, the Bank Guy, and (you have to figure) White House Aide and Cute Little Girl.

I think the Bank Guy’s critique was pretty accurate – Jack and Wayne could easily have spent the night hanging out at a Denny’s and gotten the tape in the morning. LA is a big town (not that you’d know it from the show) – it’s pretty easy to disappear for a few hours.

I wish I had Jack’s magic monocular. From inside a room while under cover, moving only a couple of degrees, he was able to scope out three different bad guys. That’s some fine optics.

It was so very Bond. 10 minutes after the show ended, I picked up my guitar and played that riff about 20 times.

I have a feeling that if you really listen, you’ll find musical jokes all over this show. Last season when Mandy Terrorslut was walking around in her miniskirt and fuck me boots, I swear the soundtrack was an homage to These Boots Were Made for Walkin’.

// minor '-jack <heh> //

flashing back to last week’s “Name the Badass” theme – couldn’t we call Mandy…

wait for it
“HiJack” Bauer?
ok, i’ll leave now.

// end hi-jack //