Daughter and BF going on overnight trip

In My Humble Opinion
61

[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
He was probably gay.
[/QUOTE]

Perhaps - he got married after I dumped him, had kids - which of course is no sign that he isn’t gay - but I never saw any sign that he was gay (no love of showtunes, no fashion sense, no appreciation for Brad Pitt’s bone structure) - just that he believed in sex being something that happened between married people. He was a religious man, and was considering the Episcopalian priesthood - he would have had to convert, he was Catholic, but the Catholic priesthood was unacceptable because he really wanted to get married at some point. If he is a latent homosexual, he is choosing and currently succeeding in living his life as a straight man, and has for fifty-some years now. At some point “he probably is gay” is probably moot.

62

[QUOTE=Dangerosa]
Perhaps - he got married after I dumped him, had kids - which of course is no sign that he isn’t gay - but I never saw any sign that he was gay (no love of showtunes, no fashion sense, no appreciation for Brad Pitt’s bone structure) - just that he believed in sex being something that happened between married people. He was a religious man, and was considering the Episcopalian priesthood - he would have had to convert, he was Catholic, but the Catholic priesthood was unacceptable because he really wanted to get married at some point. If he is a latent homosexual, he is choosing and currently succeeding in living his life as a straight man, and has for fifty-some years now. At some point “he probably is gay” is probably moot.
[/QUOTE]

In all seriousness, I’m sure that sincere religious restraints occur in men, but I think they’re the exception rather than the rule. More frequently in my experience, adult males who claim to be virgins by choice are either on the DL, conflicted as to their sexuality, really only “technical virgins” (quite common) or lying.

63

[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
In all seriousness, I’m sure that sincere religious restraints occur in men, but I think they’re the exception rather than the rule. More frequently in my experience, adult males who claim to be virgins by choice are either on the DL, conflicted as to their sexuality, really only “technical virgins” (quite common) or lying.
[/QUOTE]

Given the categories about, this guy was a “techincal virgin” - my cousin’s husband however was an honest to God (and God was a huge part of it - I won’t lie to you) virgin by choice, saving himself for marriage.

(I always kind of thought the technical virgin thing was hypocrisy, and it was a factor in me dumping him. I also think its judgmental in a way honest denial of physical intimacy really doesn’t seem to be.)

64

[QUOTE=Kalhoun]
Jeeeez…I can easily believe that some people put their religious beliefs before their physical urges. In fact, Sarahfeena (one of my all-time favorite catholics!) said on these very boards that she didn’t indulge until after she was married for one simple reason: pre-marital pregnancy was NOT an option for her (man, I hope I remembered that correctly). This could be The Boyfriend’s logic if that’s where his head is at.
[/QUOTE]

That’s pretty much it in a nutshell. No birth control is perfect, she has seen a number of her friends have babies they didn’t plan on, and says that will never ever be a worry for her. I never said there was any driven snow near her, just that I know she hasn’t had intercourse.

Neither of them are all that religious either by the way.

65

I’m curious.
At what ages do you believe every child/young adult has:
-had intercourse?
-smoked cigarettes?
-drank alcohol?
-done drugs?
Not that it will change much of anything, but I’m somewhat interested in learning exactly how much all of my kids are lying to me, and how little I know my kids. :wink:

I’m certain it is possible that a young person might not engage in some or all of those activities for reasons other than religious beliefs.

66

[QUOTE=Dinsdale]
I’m curious.
At what ages do you believe every child/young adult has:
-had intercourse?
-smoked cigarettes?
-drank alcohol?
-done drugs?
Not that it will change much of anything, but I’m somewhat interested in learning exactly how much all of my kids are lying to me, and how little I know my kids. :wink:

I’m certain it is possible that a young person might not engage in some or all of those activities for reasons other than religious beliefs.
[/QUOTE]

Agreed. I was just pointing out that the religious component on The Boyfriend’s part could be one of any number of reasons. I happen to think that people come to some or all of the above list in their own time, based on about a gajillion criteria. I happen to believe that what your daughter says is true, and I happen to believe that her boyfriend is OK with it, i.e., not getting any on the side and not gay.

67

[QUOTE=Dinsdale]
I’m curious.
At what ages do you believe every child/young adult has:
-had intercourse?
-smoked cigarettes?
-drank alcohol?
-done drugs?
Not that it will change much of anything, but I’m somewhat interested in learning exactly how much all of my kids are lying to me, and how little I know my kids. :wink:

I’m certain it is possible that a young person might not engage in some or all of those activities for reasons other than religious beliefs.
[/QUOTE]

Truthfully, I think most kids have done these things by the time they’re 18. I know I’d done the first three by my 18th birthday, and I was a good, honor-roll-making, volunteer-work-doing young’un. Your daughter may not be sexually active yet, and that’s perfectly fine. (I have a very good relationship with my dad, but I’d sooner chew ground glass than discuss my sex life with him. YMMV.) I think folks are just trying to point out that being a sexually active 20 year old is boringly, unexceptionally normal. No one’s going to think she’s the Town Crotch.

68

[QUOTE=Kalhoun]
Agreed. I was just pointing out that the religious component on The Boyfriend’s part could be one of any number of reasons. I happen to think that people come to some or all of the above list in their own time, based on about a gajillion criteria. I happen to believe that what your daughter says is true, and I happen to believe that her boyfriend is OK with it, i.e., not getting any on the side and not gay.
[/QUOTE]

Frankly, true or not, the consensual sex life (or lack thereof) really isn’t anyone’s business, and is tawdry speculation.

However, it does make the “reputation at risk” thing even more interesting, since Mrs. Dins really does seem to be concerned with Mrs. Grundy and not with the implications of sex.

In which case, Mrs. Grundy does not know what people don’t tell her.

69

[QUOTE=burundi]
Truthfully, I think most kids have done these things by the time they’re 18.

<snip>

I think folks are just trying to point out that being a sexually active 20 year old is boringly, unexceptionally normal. No one’s going to think she’s the Town Crotch.
[/QUOTE]

Agreed on both counts. It’s normal both for kids to do these things, AND for them to not necessarily feel the need to tell their parents about it. It’s also normal for parents to assume that their kids don’t do these things, unless they are absolutely unable to assume that.

70

[QUOTE=Dangerosa]
Frankly, true or not, the consensual sex life (or lack thereof) really isn’t anyone’s business, and is tawdry speculation.

However, it does make the “reputation at risk” thing even more interesting, since Mrs. Dins really does seem to be concerned with Mrs. Grundy and not with the implications of sex.

In which case, Mrs. Grundy does not know what people don’t tell her.
[/QUOTE]

Absolutely true. I’m not even quite sure how to react to the idea that someone’s reputation could get tarnished in this day and age.

I’ve always run in circles where the whole reputation thing was virtually non-existent (well, except for that one girl who murdered someone while she was pulling a train). My folks were less than pleased that my son was born out of wedlock, but the fact that I didn’t marry his asshole father made up for it.

71

I simply posted my last question because I was kinda surprised at the number of responses that said of course my kid wasn’t a virgin, and was lying to me when she said she was. Heck, I really couldn’t care less whether she was or not. As I said above, sometimes I think she could use a good lay to lighten up.

And I’ve never asked her. But she has offered the info. And I really don’t think my kid goes out of her way to lie to us (at least about that!) In actuality, I think she is a little - um - I don’t know. Prudish? Immature? Conservative? Risk averse? Well, not in terms of making judgments about anyone else’s choices, but just not sure this choice is right for her as yet.

We talk about just about pretty much everything in our family. Yeah, at times someone will say a question is too private or the info is no one else’s business. But I do not believe my kids are lying to me when they say they have not had sex, done drugs, smoked, or drank. I think they know pretty well that I’d be more disappointed at their lying to me about something like this, than the activity itself. And I’m not going to suggest that my kids have never lied to me. They have, and take it from me, they’re just not all that good at it! :wink:

Full disclosure. I misspoke above when I said I told her both her mom and I were sexually active at her age. In fact, I was sorta careful to obfuscate to my daughter. Because while my wife became sexually active while a teen, I did not lose my virginity until I was 22. And it was not because I was gay or religious. Instead, I was socially awkward around girls and the opportunity simply never presented itself. But I wasn’t more specific to my kid, as I didn’t want to give out my wife’s private info, and I thought it sorta irrelevant to the whole point of my comment to her which was to say sex isn’t a bad thing for people of my daughter’s age.

Smokes, booze, and drugs - those I had in abundance (and lied to my folks about) throughout HS. When I drank heavily I pretty much assumed everyone else did, but I really didn’t realize how little so many people drank - or not at all. Similarly, I think that just because a whole lot of well adjusted folks have sex in their teens, they are kidding themselves if they think everyone else is as well - or that the only reason they aren’t is they are saving themselves for religious reasons.

72

[QUOTE=Mr Bus Guy]

She is NOT sexually active and I know because she says so, and she knows she can tell us anything.
[/QUOTE]

This seems odd to me. I know I can tell my parents anything: my faith in their unconditional love is infinite. However, there is a great deal I choose not to tell them, not because I don’t trust them but simply because it’s private: I don’t tell them about my sex life, I don’t tell them if I have a fight with my husband, I don’t tell them if I am carrying a balance on a credit card, I don’t tell them about things that are none of their business. Doesn’t mean I don’t love them and trust them. Now then, I have no idea whether or not your daughter is entirely forthcoming with you, and I don’t really care. But if she IS choosing to keep things private, it doesn’t mean she doesn’t trust or love you. It just means it isn’t about you.

73

[QUOTE=Harriet the Spry]
What will the boyfriend’s parents think? IME they won’t think much. I bet dollars to doughnuts you wouldn’t even be posting it if it were your son we were talking about. (**Rick ** is my cite :slight_smile: )The double standard isn’t as dead as we like to think it is.
[/QUOTE]

FWIW I never had this come up with my daughter, but my response would have been the same. I never understood the overprotective father/shotgun/she won’t get to date until 32 thing.

74

[QUOTE=Mr Bus Guy]
She is NOT sexually active and I know because she says so, and she knows she can tell us anything.
[/QUOTE]

I’m honestly not trying to insinuate that she’s lying, but I have to ask - under what circumstances does she say so? Was she asked? Did she volunteer this information? And if so, in what context?

75

[QUOTE=DianaG]
I’m honestly not trying to insinuate that she’s lying, but I have to ask - under what circumstances does she say so? Was she asked? Did she volunteer this information? And if so, in what context?
[/QUOTE]

Good question (you yoo Manda JO

It’s not so much a discussion as in "Hey BusKid, you and Dick (honest to Og, his name is Dick) going at it or no?

We’re at that age where some of our friends are becoming grandparents. My wife will look at the Kid and say, so when will WE hold a grandkid? Being my kid, she usually has some sort of wise ass answer. Something like:

“when you see three guys on camels, mom”

or

"not unless I sit on the wrong toilet seat… "

Now, don’t get me wrong, I don’t expect some kind of announcement if/when she does get active, but she’s pretty deftly making a point with her answers there. If there is any change in the status quo, I imagine mom will gear it before me anyway.

76

Oh. Again, she’s your kid, so you’d know better than I do, but…

If my parents had asked me that when I was 22, I’d have given similar answers, and *all * they would have meant is “I’m not discussing this with you.”

77

[QUOTE=Mr Bus Guy]
Good question (you yoo Manda JO

It’s not so much a discussion as in "Hey BusKid, you and Dick (honest to Og, his name is Dick) going at it or no?

We’re at that age where some of our friends are becoming grandparents. My wife will look at the Kid and say, so when will WE hold a grandkid? Being my kid, she usually has some sort of wise ass answer. Something like:

“when you see three guys on camels, mom”

or

"not unless I sit on the wrong toilet seat… "

Now, don’t get me wrong, I don’t expect some kind of announcement if/when she does get active, but she’s pretty deftly making a point with her answers there. If there is any change in the status quo, I imagine mom will gear it before me anyway.
[/QUOTE]

Could mean that they are doubling up on birth control, have less sex at more fertile times of the month, and otherwise doing everything possible to prevent becoming pregnant, keeping a script for Plan B in case of a condom breakage… but still having sex. Or she just considers it unlikely, and since it really isn’t something she’s thinking about, she dismisses it with a joke.

But I don’t know your daughter. I just know that that’s how I handled things at that age, as did at least a friend or two that I’m close enough with for this sort of thing to be talked about.

I am willing to believe that some 20 year olds, and even older, are still virgins by choice, too. Not everyone chooses the same things in life.

78

Not to mention, you can find sex pretty nifty while finding the idea of babies quite repellent. I know I do, and I’m 33!

So I wouldn’t take any opinions on childbearing as meaning anything vis-a-vis gettin’ it on.

79

[QUOTE=Dinsdale]
My daughter is a good student, and (I think) not sexually active
[/QUOTE]

lol

80

She’s twenty years old. If she’s a virgin, it’s because she’s made the decision not to have sex. And if she isn’t, she decided otherwise. Either way, decisions about her sex life are no longer under parental control.