i didn’t mean any offense with my post Lyllyan. it just reminds me of a psychology study i read once. it said that one of the reasons shy people were shy was because whenever they tried to interact, they were so bad at understanding how social interaction worked that they were punished for their failings and they became even more shy as a result.
You’re probably onto something. I guess just talking to women like humans would be my best bet (it has worked in the past).
go for it, i don’t think i interact with people enough. I need more experience.
OK. Stop the presses. You mean you’re not an entirely different species to us?
No offense taken, Calc.
I completely understand the study results.
As stated earlier, (I think), if my SO wasn’t so extroverted, we would have never met. I was literally afraid to open my mouth for fear of saying something enormously stupid, then being laughed at, or worse, totally ignored. I was so bad that I couldn’t even raise my hand in class to answer a question. I dressed in dark colors to be less visable etc… This lead to an awful lot of muttering on my part. I did it so much people began to think I must have said something off color or so totally hilarous that they would demand I repeat it.
After several years of this, I finally decided I didn’t give a shit what they thought, and said what I wanted to, whether they agreed or not. Very liberating it was/is. Of course I don’t say everything I think, but enough where I can hold my own in a conversation fairly well.
From Random:
Oh, hi there Random- didn’t see you over there hiding behind that faceatious little romp through the wiles of women. Ain’t you cute? (bats eyelashes)
Calc- I promise- whether or not you may miss some social cues (we all do) and whether or not you have self-diagnosed as chronically, irrevocably shy- we like you, we really do.
Honestly- just ask us about ourselves. Any perspective companion in your age group (assuming 20 to 30) is in the same state of flux and personal growth that you are- and would love to tell you all about who she is. Just listen and ask open-ended questions.
“Tell me about your family-do you have any pets, what is your favorite music, food, weather,(insert mundane topic of your choice here)”
If she has any manners at all, she will ask you similar questions and conversation will progress on it’s own. There’s no trick, no pheromone, no pick-up line that will work on every woman. Just ask questions, smile or at least keep your expression neutral, nod alot, encourage her, and search for topics you agree on.
That is definitely your best bet, not to mention the best way to show a woman you respect her. It’s not an easy thing to get used to, either; you’re accustomed to talking to women very, very carefully, afraid that the wrong word at the wrong time will leave her repulsed and you alone. It’s hard to let go of that internal filter and actually talk, but it works.
Be sure to ask questions a lot. Ask about her. Where’s she from? Does she like Hitchcock movies? What about Indian food? Who was better: the Pixies or the Clash? And then (this is important) pay attention to the answers and answer them yourself, and next thing you know you’re having a conversation.
Well, yeah, we are, but we are trying to encourage Calc, not scare him off. 
However, if she says that she doesn’t like Hitchcock movies, it’s usually not a good idea to shout “What? You didn’t like Vertigo? Philistine! Boor! You probably think Van Sant did a better Psycho, too!” and stomp off.
Learn from my mistakes, grasshopper.
thats kinda what i do wrong too. when i like a girl i tend to throw things at her until i get her attention, then i start giggling uncontrollably and run away with my face hidden in my hands.
HUH.
Since you’re asking for advice, I’d say, until your current mindset changes, don’t bother. Seriously, and I mean this in the nicest possible way. From some of your writings I’m getting the feeling that you don’t really like people, and that you are horrified of being embarrassed.
Wanting a GF to say that you’ve had the experience is kind of like flying round-trip to Rome, not ever leaving the airport and then claiming that you’ve been to Italy. Technically you have, but many would argue that you did not truly have the experience of visiting Italy. Additionally, a relationship with another person is not a one way street. Women are not jugs of milk to be plucked off the store shelves at your convenience. Entering into a relationship just to check off your mental been there/done that list is a really cruel thing to do. Other people’s emotions are not play toys.
Personally, it is my opinion that as long as you view this as something to be accomplished for the sake of accomplishment that you are not going to get very far. Now, if you want a girlfriend because you’d like to experience the things that come with a special, intimate friendship then let me change my tune. In that case:
1- It’s time to talk to some one (a professional) about the social phobias you seem to have. You can try to address these yourself, but it’s much harder that way, it takes longer, and there’s no one to call you on the bullshit/excuse/rationalization factor.
2- Spruce yourself up. Get a haircut, eat right, hit the gym for some cardiovascular exercise. Wear clothes that suit your personal style, but which also happen to flatter you and don’t look like they were scavenged from a bag lady’s cart.
Lastly, … Risk, it’s not just a board game. Being human is all about being a weird mixed back of tricks and strange reactions. There is no cure for this other than death. You will have to take some risks, but there are some ways to mitigate the way it feels as some people have already described.
Or you can always go the swingers route:
“All I do is stare at their mouths and wrinkle my nose, and I turn out to be a sweetheart.”
that always seem to work out pretty well, at least you get to tear up a lot of phone numbers.
But what if being formal and reserved is being yourself? What should you do then?
Calc,
You say you don’t want a girlfriend, or even friends, but I don’t believe you for a moment.
Instead I hear an introverted kid frustrated at what he presumes “dating” is like. But instead of participating, this kid is looking in through a window, too afraid to “embarass” himself or look foolish in front of other people, thinking what he does at age 25 will doom him for life. So he builds up walls where he will be safe and no one will hurt him. Dissatisfied, he feels compelled to share his feelings in a community that is not only safe (becuase it is online and there is a level of anonymity), but also the posters tend to be more on the intelligent side (like himself).
I don’t believe you not only because you also admitted that you are attracted to people and you have gone so far as to try a 20 second gaze trick, :rolleyes: but also becuase companionship is a basic need. I don’t believe you because I know how you feel, I’ve been there too. And upon reading that, don’t you DARE think “no you don’t, no one does.” We all have to face opening ourselves up and risk being hurt when and where we’re most vulnerable.
I strongly recommend you table the “meeting up with ladies” advice for the time being and get some professional therapist help to get rid of the self-defeating habits you have. Because from what I’ve read, you don’t give other people a chance to like you, you reject them before they have a chance.
And for anyone who feels I’m being overly harsh with Calc: I am making challenging observations because I know too well the kind of unhappiness Calc is feeling, and I know that no one is doing it to Calc but himself, and from the little I know of him from his posts, he doesn’t deserve this kind of self-abuse.
But Captain, it is not logical to assume that criticizing your spelling would cause you to reciprocate with what humans call “flirty” behavior. My calculations indicate that 77.845 percent of women criticized in that way would simply be irritated.
Date well and prosper.
I’ll second the warnings about the Friend Zone.
I’ve been in the Friend Zone with a girl for six years now (all of high school, plus one year) and romantically, I’ve been frustrated, jealous and maybe even a little angry (at myself, mostly). It’s not a fun place to be, and you’ll end up more insecure by the end than when you started.
from Snooooopy:
Well, Snooooopy, how does one drop the proverbial handkerchief while online? (again, bats eyelashes, though a bit futilely this time)
And I draw the line at StarTrek. But please feel free to throw all the Shatnerisms my way that you can. That man is damned entertaining. :dubious:
MISTER TAMBOURINE MAN!!!
lno blurted:
Yeah, that’s the stuff. More of that. And Calc, this goes for you, too. You need to brush up on your Shatner. And don’t forget the eyebrow :dubious:
Chicks dig Shatner.
Loosen up?
Really, I’m not trying to be snarky. If you find that formal and reserved is working for you, then by all means, but I’ve always found that the more outgoing and engaging you are, the more likely you are to get dates. It’s a matter of getting noticed; women aren’t liable to spy you sitting silently across the room and decide, “That’s the man for me!” You’ve got to put some of yourself–your personality, your interests, your talents–out there on display.
Still waters may run deep, but no one goes surfing on them.
Hey you!
i prefer people call me on my bullshit or shatter my rationalizations, but did you have to be offensive when you did it? that eye trick was one of my first forays into meeting people.
You are somewhat right though. when i was at walmart an hour ago i was thinking and i came to the conclusion that i want the ability to make friends and girlfriends most of all. Just having one fall into my lap isn’t enough, i want the ability to go out and get a friend or a girlfriend if i want one.
so what’d you do to get beyond it? i dont know if i’ll see a therapist because its expensive and esoteric.