I'm sorry you can't get pregnant, but...

The BBQ Pit
1

OK, this is really a rant per se, but I have a feeling that responses to my OP may get a bit brutal, which is why I’m posting in the Pit.

Some of you know I’m pregnant. Currently at 26 weeks. This is my third child, and it was totally unplanned. I was in shock for two good months after I found out I was pregnant, because I was adamant that two was enough, a sentiment which I shared with absolutely EVERYONE I came in contact with, friends and family included.

About the time I fell pregnant, one of my relatives had a miscarriage. So far she has had a few miscarriages; she hasn’t managed to carry a child to term. She wants a baby, badly. She knew that I was happy with just two.

Apparently, the news that I’m having a third hasn’t filled her with glee. I don’t expect it to, considering that she found out I was pregnant just as she miscarried. Obviously I feel terrible about my timing, and I should have used better birth control.

But according to other family members, even now, six months down the track, my name can’t be mentioned in front of her without her getting depressed. This makes me very upset, because before this whole fiasco we got along extremely well. We live in different countries, so I don’t have the opportunity to cross her path often, but I would love to be able to correspond with her via e-mail. But the messages I’m getting from the rest of the family suggest that maybe that wouldn’t be a good idea.

I know she is upset that I got pregnant at the drop of a hat, and yet she can’t carry a pregnancy to term. I know it pisses her off that I didn’t want a third and am having one anyway, whereas she can’t even give birth to her first. BTW, I have NOT been rubbing that in at all. I haven’t even spoken to her since I got pregnant, at the advice of the rest of the family. I cannot even imagine the stress she must be feeling when faced with the reality of IVF or hormone treatments, or even worse, the possibility that having a child of her own will amount to zero.

But is it too much to ask that she not hold all of that against me? Are we doomed to have no relationship from now on because I have kids and she doesn’t? Am I expected to give her as much time as she needs, even if that translates into years? And why do I have to feel guilty because I have kids?

I’m just sad that an event which is so important to my husband and I (and the rest of our family) has become a source of discord. Is she going to resent my child in the future if it turns out that she CAN’T have kids of her own?

2

Should have previewed…this ISN’T really a rant per se.

Maybe it’ll make more sense now…

3

She probably doesn’t hold it against you. I had a pregnancy loss, and for a month or so, passing a pregnant woman, baby store,or even seeing an ad with a baby could make me cry. The same things made me depressed until I got pregnant again four months later, and I believe it would have lasted longer if I hadn’t become pregnant again so soon. My family did try to limit my contact with my sister’s and brother’s very young children " for my sake", but strangely enough, those were the only two young children that didn’t get me upset. Which is a long way around to my point that just because your family is advising you not to speak to her doesn’t mean that she requested it.

4

Count your blessings & be compassionate to her.

She will get over it.

Take it from someone that can’t have children.

Unless you have an infertility problem, it is impossible to describe to someone who does not.

And no, I don’t think she will resent your child.

I used to have a hard time going to hospitals to welcome the new arrivals of family & friends.

I’d cry, etc.

Hang in there & remember, count your blessings. :slight_smile:

Michie

5

Maybe you should try contacting her yourself, rather than letting what your family thinks get in your way.

If she doesn’t want to communicate with her, she should be able to let you know.

6

It’s tough, Tsubaki :frowning:

As an infertile woman, I’d suggest you leave her alone. She may not be able to let you know politely and sanely that she just cannot cope. I really think her need to be a wounded person who just cannot be around pregnant people and/or babies overrides your want for the friendship. I know that sucks the big one but unless you’ve been there, let me assure you there is no hell like the hell that is wanting a baby and losing babies and watching other people conceive carelessly and have no problems. Sanity doesn’t enter into it. Caring about the other person doesn’t enter into it. You just can’t bring yourself to be around that person in any way at all because the pain really is that great and all-encompassing. It passes but it takes time.

I hope she manages to conceive and it sticks. I hope she then has the grace to be able to mend fences. Or if permanent infertility is her lot in life then she has the grace to be able to move back into your life.

I’d certainly leave doors open to her but I wouldn’t try and make contact happen. It’s not that she resents your baby per se – it’s that it all hurts unbelievably and it’s too much to ask for her to be able to continue the relationship. I can see it from your POV and no, I don’t think you need to feel guilty but this may not be fixable in the short term.

Pregnancy loss sucks, oh man, does it suck :frowning:

7

Thanks everyone, and especially for not jumping on me.

I’m thinking you’re right, Primaflora. I should just leave her alone.

There IS some light at the end of the tunnel. She is able to GET pregnant, just not STAY pregnant, and her doctor thinks it may have to do with hormone levels, so she will have hormone tests done. We all have our fingers crossed.

8

I was in a similar situation.

An aquaintance had just been given the news that she was almost 100% infertile and would never have her own kids. She was standing in a group of girls when one of them asked me when the babies would be coming (I’d just gotten married a couple of months beforehand). I told them we weren’t going to have kids. This was followed by the usual “why?” and when I said that I had no desire to be a parent, this woman launched into a verbal attack, screaming at the top of her lungs at me, and calling me all sorts of nasty things. I had no idea that she was infertile, otherwise I probably would’ve made a vaguer response than what I did.

Anyway, I didn’t take any of the nastiness personally (although a lot of it was very hurtful) simply because I knew it was her pain and despair that was causing her to lash out. I could see her pain in her eyes.

I don’t think this is the sort of thing you should broach with your relative at all. Definitely not by e-mail. Let her come to you, if she ever gets to the point where she can bear the contact. Don’t feel guilty, because you have nothing to feel guilty about. Try and not let her pain hurt you personally.

All the best, Tsubaki-chan :slight_smile:

9

It’s tricky; sure on planet Vulcan nobody would bear grudges, but your friend is understandably upset. People do irrational things when they are upset.

My wife and I were the first couple to get married in our little circle of friends and the first to concieve, but due to two twenty-week miscarriages (and the investigative intervals between) we were the last couple to have children, personally, it didn’t bother me a lot and in fact seeing all these other children arriving gave me hope, but I started from a position of hope and I could well understand that someone feeling hopeless in the same situation might feel bitter towards everyone who ‘has it so easy’.

I did feel a little bitter towards some of the young women who shared a hospital ward with my wife when the miscarriages occurred as some of them were in there for abortions as a result of nothing more than slack attitudes towards birth control; it didn’t seem fair(to me) that they should so casually dispose of something we were trying so hard to preserve, but I never went as far as blurting my feelings out to them.

Your friend clearly needs your support, you might not get any thanks for that support in the near future (or ever).

10

Wow, thought this was going to be a nasty reply to JBJ’s thread in MPSIMS. Coulda gotten nasty.

The situation sounds ugly. I don’t think she’d resent your kid in the long-term future, though. It seems like some people want to be pregnant, or have a baby, not have a kid. Having a kid is the obvious result, but as cynical as it may sound, the ‘newness’ eventually wears off. Once your pregnancy and baby become ‘just’ your third kid, I don’t see how it could contribute to familial discord, unles she’s really good at holding a grudge.

Congrats on the new one. Now you get to have the joy of having a ‘middle child’. :slight_smile:

11

This is going to sound New Age and wishy-washy, but…

In ancient cultures, weren’t pregnant women regarded as symbols of fertility in their own right? Were Tsubaki’s relative (geography allowing) able to spend more time around her - mystic vibes and hormone transfers apart - wouldn’t gradually accepting Tsu’s pregnancy, sharing in her joy and relaxing from her own stress and misery possibly make her more likely to conceive?

Yeah I realise how impossibly hard this might be for an infertile woman desperate to have a child, but sitting at home, bottling it up, carrying resentment - those things though very understandable must surely create a vicious cycle where it’s even harder to conceive.

My aunt and uncle were yet another of those couples who tried for years, tried IVF, went through every stress and hell, and only when they actually totally gave up the effort to have kids did they actually (miraculously) conceive, and went on to have two healthy, lovely daughters. A stressed body can only be a less fertile one.

12

I just had a miscarriage 17 days ago. I can obviously identify with your friend, but maybe from a different perspective than you’re thinking. I have three friends + a sister-in-law who are due within the next two months and I really can’t talk to them right now. It’s not that I’m angry at them or resent their ability to carry their babies to term; it’s that I just don’t want to ruin their joy. I cry at the thought of babies right now and have to turn the radio off when our local maternity shop airs its ads. I really don’t want to turn into a weeping mess when I see them and I really can’t bring myself to listen to all the details about kicking, sleeping problems, swollen hands, etc. that they’re brimming with. I can’t, at this moment, share my news and then joyfully listen to theirs. I might be able to soon, but just not now.
Be patient with her. Hopefully, she’ll be able to get the treatment she needs (I think there are several workable solutions to hormone deficiencies during pregnancy) and be able to have a baby. She might be really happy for you right now, just not able to show it.

13

She might not get over it. Especially if she can’t rationalize that you aren’t pregnant to spite her.

The same time I was being born, my father’s sister was in the same hospital having a miscarriage. She already had a daughter, but wanted more children. She never had any (I think it was an RH factor problem).

Anyway, this bitter and vindictive woman took every opportunity to make my life miserable because I was a constant reminder of her miscarriages. This is exactly what she told me when, as a five year old, I asked her why she hated me.

Keep your kids aways from this woman. Just in case.

P.S. Congratulations anyway!

14

As a guy, I know it’s not my place to post about a subject like this, and (even though it’s the Pit), I really don’t want to offend anyone, so if I do, I can’t say it’s unintentional, because I’m aware that there’s a possibility. But in advance, if anyone is offended, I apologise.

Now that that’s done with, it seems to me that if:

  1. You are pregnant with an unplanned child who I’m sure you’ll love. You said that it’s an event that is important to you and your husband. But still, it came across to me (though I could be WAY off, please tell me if I am) that you don’t really want a third child, even at this point, and

  2. This relative of your can’t carry a pregnancy to term. She’s jealous and hurt, and this is causing some turbulence in the family.

  3. Insert greetings to whomever you wish here. I’m not taking sides. :wink:

Then it seems to me that you could ask this relative to “help out” in a way she may like…intra-family adoption is common, and afaik, a fairly simple process.
She gets a baby, you have your two children, potential rifts are healed before they get a chance to grow and your baby will remain in the family. Perhaps knowing the situation, perhaps not, however you see fit.

Honestly, I don’t know if it’s a workable solution, and I feel like the guy who looks over the mechanic’s shoulder and makes suggestions without knowing how to change a tire himself. But I just thought I’d throw it out there.

15

"intra-family adoption is common, and afaik, a fairly simple process. She gets a baby, you have your two children, potential rifts are healed before they get a chance to grow and your baby will remain in the family. "

This was my first thought when I read the OP, but I was reluctant to suggest it. I’m glad I wasn’t the only person with that idea.

16

/LONG-time-getting-pregnant-and-finally-a-parent hat ON/
GrizzWife and I spent nine years trying to get pregnant. It seemed as if it’d never happen for us, no matter how much Artificial Reproductive Technology we used.

GrizzWife’s best friend, Michelle, gets pregnant. We’re happy for her. The relationship’s strained because GrizzWife’s getting DAILY injected drugs (guess who gets to administer them!) and our IVF attempt fails. We have some frozen embryos to use for another attempt, though.
Michelle suffers stillbirth of her son at eight months into the pregnancy. We’re all in tears.
GrizzWife and I are heartbroken to learn that some frozen embryos left over from our first attempt did not survive the thaw and cannot be used.
Michelle gets pregnant again. We strain to smile against our tears.
GrizzWife goes through another series of injestions for another IVF attempt and we suffer another failure. We have some frozen embryos, so we’ll try again later.
Michelle suffers miscarriage fairly far along in her pregnancy. We grieve unconsollably for days.
Michelle and her husband decide to quite trying to have children. It hurts too much emotionally for them
Finally, on our fourth IVF attempt, we became pregnant with boy/girl twins!
Michelle stops calling and we’re afraid to call her for fear that it’ll only open old wounds for her.
During the pregnancy, GrizzWife became bedridden with an incompetent cervix and had a cerclage put in place to hold it shut. She had to be hospitalized during week #28 because our son’s amniotic sac sprung a leak.
Babies were born at week #31 (9 weeks early).
Our son was 4lbs, 5oz and spent six more weeks in hospital.
Our daughter survived only three days.
Michelle takes entire month of July off work (both of her losses happened in July of consecutive years). She can’t to bear being around anyone during that month.

Then…magically…all that changed.
We all needed our time to sort through the feelings that were draining us emotionally.

Drop her a little note or send her some flowers or balloons and let her knokw that you’re thinking about her. Then, let her alone for a while. When she feels up to it, she’ll resume a relationship with you.
/LONG-time-getting-pregnant-and-finally-a-parent hat OFF/

17

Fucking hell, do you people think babies are puppies? There’s grief involved in adoption for the baby, the relinquishing mother and the receiving mother.

Repeat after me several times – adoption does not cure or fix infertility. Having a live baby does bring joy but it is not a simple fix of hand over the baby like a bag of fucking flour.

And please people – if you are going to trot out that stupid old shibboleth that stress reduces fertility and that if infertile women just relaxed they’d be popping them out like nobody’s business go and do some reading. Hanging out with pregnant women does nothing for infertility and stress does not reduce fertility. Babies are not miscarried due to stress. There’s a list of causes; stress does not feature.

18

Although I wasn’t thrilled at the prospect of having a third, the rest of my family is (read; husband and other two kids) and I have become used to the idea now. Having spoken to many friends with three kids, they have all told me how the third is very special, so I’m actually starting to look forward to the birth.

The whole idea of adoption/surrogacy HAS crossed my mind, so I’m not offended at anyone’s suggestions. The obstacles are my husband (he WANTS three kids) and the fact that my child will be biracial, whereas any children of my relative won’t be. I know, that shouldn’t be an issue, but it would be. And as Primaflora said, I don’t think she’d be happy to have one of my kids just so she can raise one. She wants a child which shares her and her husband’s genes.

THAT’S my biggest fear.

19

I say do as GrizzRich suggested.

Yes, we infertile women get sad & frustrated.

We simply cannot understand why we can’t.

All sorts of things run through your mind.

But stop letting her pain & depression put fear into you.

All she needs is some time, space & understanding.

Just let her know that you have not excluded her out of your life or those of your children.

She’s not going to flip & turn into the wicked witch.

Believe it or not, we have enough stigma against the fact that we have no children, the last thing we need is people to side step us because of our infertilty & the pain it causes.

She will, in time, get over it & be able to joyfully welcome other’s new arrivals. You just got to give her time to more or less build up an immunity & come to terms with her station in life.

After she does that, most of us with thios problem will spoil you & your kids rotten! :slight_smile:

20

Thank you so much Primaflora!

I went through the infertility thing. I’m an adoptive mom and the mom of one surprise bio child. Adoption is painful for all parties. Family adoption can be REALLY tough. Common, simple intra-family adoptions occur when mom is incompetent and Grandma adopts. Can you imagine being the child?

“Mom, why was I put up for adoption?”

“Your aunt didn’t want you and we did.”

“But Mom, Aunt T has a couple of kids, you mean she just didn’t want me! Obviously, she wanted her other kids”

Setting up the kid there for some major adoption related issues! There isn’t the nice outs of “your birthmom wasn’t married, was too young, wasn’t ready.”

And adoption isn’t a cure for infertility, its a cure for childlessness. And telling an infertile women to relax is like telling a diabetic to stop eating so much sugar or a depressive that they just need to cheer up - it ain’t that simple and blames the person for their own disease. Besides, women get pregnant during war. Queens give birth when the weight of a nation is upon them (imagine the stress of being the third wife of Henry VIII! But Jane pulled through - well, she died in childbed, but she did get knocked up and produced a male heir (who probably died of TB, but that isn’t exactly her fault)).

Pregnancy and babies hurt when you can’t get pregnant. Since you are not physically close, drop her a note, mention everything but your pregnancy and kids. Whatever you both talked about before you got married…movies, books, cute guys, politics, whatever. Let her be the one to introduce the topic of husbands, pregnancy and children.

And don’t say “you can always adopt.” Duh! Do you think infertile people live in a box? We know its an option - but its something that you need to come to on your own.