Wow has it gotten quiet or what? We are off to, what appears to be, a darn good start. And now we fight the stinking crickets. I know it’s the holidays and all but sheesh. We’ve barely got two RL days to make another decision.
Ok, I’ll at least try to get some discussion going even at the risk of my own demise.
And to those of you who say this is fishing, well pffft.
Theory/Set up question (JSexton or others of their ilk). We now know that there are Masons actually in the game. For a group this size about how many would be expected? The reason I ask is that in the first game I ever played I was in a Mason group of two. When Shadow claimed I really did not know what to do. Eventually, (took about an hour or so RL) I went ahead and claimed as well. It turned out good when the town won handily.
I certainly don’t want to presume to tell a power role what to do, and I consider Masons to be such but can we at least talk about the implications of what happened yesterDay and last Night.
You see I am trying to keep us focused on at least discussing something. If not this then any other suggestion would be acceptable. Crap, it could be about the Cowboys kicking the Eagles’ ass this afternoon or the global warming threat of having us all grow gills because of rising water levels for all I care.
And pede little or no feedback from you would be acceptable. Just trying to get a sense where folks are. Certainly don’t want anything specific unless it would be advantageous to town.
Mod question: Since you were so specific about Night Zero actions (thank you). Can we get an update on who did what Night One?
I think the above information could prove helpful.
Mason where discussed early Day one, see this post for example.
To me, you are someone I can’t make sense of. Your discussion of the Night One actions so far is ‘Fuck, Yee Haw, Shit. Why those three?’.
The mason thing is OK to point out, but since it’s the masons call, not much to discuss.
While some of your mod questions are valid, others are simply won’t be answered (and you know it). You asked a question like that on Day One as well. Do you think asking such questions will help relevant discussion?
What’s your opinion of Hawkeyeops and my analysis of the macey voters? Who or what roles do you think killed the people Tonight? What of the new votes Today?
Ok. I’ll try to address your questions. If my response is not adequate please feel free to follow up. I think that those that have played with me in the past know that I am seldom at a loss for words. How coherent those words may be could fill volumes.
Fuck We lost an investigtor. That kind of sucks.
Yee Haw Another scum is dead.
Shit A town power role bites it.
And if you knew my history with story you would know that when he is the mod that invariably ask him a TON of questions. Juvenille, perhaps, but I like to dick with him in that regard. The one that struck home with me was when he commented on Idle’s off board game (The non FB site) along the lines that he was glad he was playing and not having to answer my incessant questions. Kind of a running joke between the two of us, don’t you know.
I think your analysis of the Macey voters is just that: your analysis. I am on record that I thought Fishy was scum. Hey, I am wrong more often than not. That doesn’t make me anti-town, just human. And I try to take Mhaye’s non agenda when I talk about Hawk. Same with Nanook and Pleo. There is no doubt that we approach these games differently and hence we are always scrutinizing each other.
I hope some of this makes some sort of sense. I really am trying to play a little more conventional since I do I enjoy this activity and don’t want to be the Judas of the group.
It is probably not as simple as the player with the most vote gets lynched at night, but I don’t think TF having the most votes and being dead is coincidental. Perhaps there is a Serial Killer who can only take out the night’s vote leader. Maybe there are town or scum players with abilities related to night votes. I don’t think we should avoid voting for people at night, but we need to be careful that the vote leader at night’s end is who we want it to be.
Darnit Hawk. Right after I say that your philosophy and mine are not congruent you post something that is totally in line with what I was thinking.
Three deaths. One almost assuredly scum related. One Vig Or PFK, most likely. Another ascribed to some other game mechanic.
Can’t do squat about the first other than getting rid of scummers.
Vig or PFK means that we would have to determine win conditions and whether or not that condition is favorable to town or not.
Some other game mechanism. Maybe if we figure that one out we would have an inside track to victory.
And this is total metagame but of all the Mods (no fucking offense intended) story and sach seem to be the most cerebral (Hawk is approaching this parthenon - Idle no way in hell) I think this one might be solvable.
So Natlaw et. al. that’s where I am at, currently.
The other place that I am at regards timing. We don’t have a whole heck of a lot of time left in this Day. And I know I was chastised once, but I have to be consistent with my nature and game play/style.
Well, we definitely have different play styles. I’m a computer programmer, so being analytical is my style. Your posts are kinda fun to read, but to me are more like a puzzle within the game .
Parsing that post just gives me an out of cheese error:
-On surface you seem to answer my questions, but you’re actually dodging them all (on preview I see you posted a better answer to the first).
-What is Mhaye’s non agenda?
-How is it related to Hawkeyeop? You seemed to agree to his analysis method in P1.270, do you agree with his results?
-Why link Nanook and Pleonast or are you just applying MHaye’s non agenda to them? If the latter, why not apply it to the all players?
Anyway, if I try to ignore your smoke, most of your actions seems OK:
+promoting discussion (mentioning short days, calling out lurkers)
+telling that late votes aren’t very useful
+you did indirectly respond to the macey situation (saying why wouldn’t scum try blatant fishing?)
Then again it’s all safe content (about game play, not the players). Your Thing Fish vote argument was already used by others (not that it was a bad reason). bufftabby also warned against the ‘scum would never do that’ meme and how there was useless strategy discussion.
We lost two townies yet gained one dead scum? 2 for 2 on Day 2 is not bad at all as I see it. Sure, it sucks they had to be power roles, but I’d make that trade any game.
Based on colour, I doubt that the kill had anything to do with a night lynch. I mean… if town is doing the lynching, wouldn’t we know it?
I don’t have a strong enough ping from anyone yet to cast a vote… I’ll keep reading the day, and cast one as early as I can defend.
IIRC, **story **was challenged in the setup thread over the size of the game; his response was along the lines of “that won’t be a problem for long”. With four deaths in one Day/Night cycle, I can see the truth in that. So two (nearly) dead scum out of those four is, as mentioned, pretty good going. But if we start Day 3 with a total of six town dead, it won’t look quite so rosy.
Although I agree that the coincidence of Thing Fish being both vote-leader and dead is probably no coincidence at all, I’m not sure there’s anything telling about story publishing vote counts at Night. He does it during the day and for practical voting purposes, the Night is just the beginning of a longer Day. It’s just as likely that we’ve got a Vig who’s decided to align with town/duck responsibility by killing the vote-leader.
In any case, this should remind us all that votes count.
I’m quite tempted to join peekercpa in a LTL move, because to have no participation in a whole Day/Night is a little ridiculous. But that’s a faute de mieux option. Better to find an active player. So:
vote dotchan
I’ve already called out what I thought was a very smudgy post aimed at me:
I also find her vote on Cookies today completely wrong-headed:
It’s quite noticeable from Natlaw’s Day/Night One vote summary that **Cookies **was the first to vote for both her candidates. If **dotchan **had said that she found Cookie’s votes weakly argued, that would be one thing. But characterising them as “me too” votes is a misrepresentation.
Ok, Nat I’ll try again since my first reponse was not sufficient. And, I’ll do these until the cows come home since I believe that discourse is ultimately in the town’s interest.
A peek explan(ion is coming up so cover the junior’s ears.
MHaye’s non agenda is pretty typical. He typically opens the game with a word of caution about not letting a previous game influence behavior in the current game. Good advice, I might add. I don’t want some poor soul lynching me today in this game because of what I did or did not do to them in the last game. Basically, every game is a unique event and carrying baggage is not helpful a bit.
What I was trying to get to in the hawk response was the relational part of his observation. I believe that micro (in game) interactions are a fruitful avenue of discussion/observation/conclusion. I also believe (well, want to believe) that macro (out of game) relationships should be discounted. The fact that santo wants to pee in **buff[/]'s butt should not make us come to a conclusion about their in game relationship.
And there was no intended link between Nanook and Pleo other than as an example of folks that I tend to get cross wise because of play style. Pleo since he is a rententive bastard, IMHO. And, Nanook because he is so fucking reticent. I mean, both of them are damn good players but the first needs to lighten up and the second needs to be more contributory. Because I respect them and wish that they wouldn’t be so tight assed and tight lipped.
And it’s only because I have played with them so much that I feel free to share that observation. I am sure that they would have the same thing to say about me - namely I don’t play this game by the book and it sometimes gives them the red ass.
And this is probably a point of order but, Meh. I like being a little, in your terms - smoky. Seems more fun that way. The peek explanation meme was all the rage for a while but the Dildoes went extinct. Or was it a Bilbo? Fuck, I think it might have been a Doo Doo. Mother of Og I think it was the Duncan man.
I don’t ever recall being with you in a game (unless you have a different handle elsewhere) but I can tell you that I do like your frankness. Let’s continue this discussion. At your pleasure, of course.
Finally! I’m back from holiday travels and ready to devote the necessary time to the game. That is pretty sweet that we got us another scum, but the loss of the investigator sucks - especially before he had any chance to lay us some breadcrumbs.
The mason death also sucks, but at least that pretty much confirms Pedescribe as town. I gotta do some re-reading to see if I can find something in the posts. But, for now - at least til we get some response - Vote Blaster Master.
Seriously - he has done nothing in the way of participation and yet has very little suspicion on him. If he is scum and trying to cruise under the radar, it seems to be working.
Chucara (2) NAF, Diggit (both left from yesterDay)
BLAM (2) peek, brewha (both new toDay and recent)
peek (1) Natlaw (from yesterDay)
Hawkeyeop (1) Cookies (toDay)
dotchan (1) amrussel (toDay)
I may have easily made a mistake, as I didn’t really look over all of Night 1, I jsut went from **story’**s last count and looked over Day 2 so far. I’m operating under the assumption that votes by people who are now dead are removed. (a safe assumption, I hope)
We’ve got less than 2 calendar days, and nothing blatantly obvious.
Cookies, can you clarify what you meant by a scummy card trick being played by hawkeyeop?
This is really going to require a re-read and some good participation after the weekend to get some good info.
Since Blaster Master could really be lurking, how about we use him as Night Lynch test subject (all vote for him next Night)?
If he really isn’t online it gives him some extra time. Blaster Master’s last activity: Today 12:27 PM, so maybe another lurker :dubious:
If you want to vote for a lurker Today, I suggest a low post count one. They more likely to defend, so we get more discussion.
Just to be sure:
Storyteller, does this also mean you won’t tell us if someone else is really AWOL in a private message either?
I guess not since we’re allowed to quote the PMs.
Hi folks. The flu took me out since Christmas eve. I’ve been sorta following along, but not with my best brain engaged. I need to start a fresh read from towards the end of day one, but at a glance, finding two scum early is gold. Not just because hitting scum is good, but because it gives us more solid info to work with on re-read. I’d strongly suggest that everyone take the time to go back over posts that interact with macey and bufftabby…and those that notably fail to interact when they should.
I would expect scum on day one to either defend Macey, or ignore him all together. Anyone who pushed someone else’s lynch is by definition attempting to protect Macey. There are certainly some scum there, as evidences by Buff’s outing. I would put the people who ignored Macey in the mild scumtell camp. Ones who didn’t really post at all like Blaster would be more of a neutral tell.
Naf,
Before I put those posts together, I was fully planning on voting for you. However, you really just had that one instance of suspicion. Amrussell only had one or two suspicious posts. Cookies on the other hand made a series of attempts to move the lynch away from Macey.
I didn’t include it in my post summary, because it didn’t directly deal with Macey, but Cookies smudge of Hockey also activated my scumdar. She called Hockey suspicious for having a me too vote. Now the case against Macey was pretty much all one action. I’m not sure how you would vote for him without it counting it as a me too vote. Thus, I believe Cookies was attempting to move the conversation to Hockey, and warning everyone else not to vote for Macey. She put the rest of the town on notice that if you vote for Macey for me too reasons, she would go after you. Since me too was pretty much the only way to make that vote, Cookies was going to go after you.
So between that, the posts I quoted, and her preemptive attempts to attack my methods so she could question my conclusion, she done a fair bit more than the other two candidates. While Naf and Amrussell could be conceivably mistaken townies (and really we don’t even know Naf was wrong), Cookies has more of a pattern of activity.
I understand townies can be wrong. In fact I’ve argued it many times. However, I think we need to look at this from a scum perspective as well. If you were scum and one of your teammates was in danger day one what would you do. Would you just let him be lynched? On day 1 when reasons are facetious at best? I strongly believe that some scum would attempt to argue against such a lynch. Only two or three players made such an argument. There is going to be scum amongst those people.
There is no post restrictions, so Blaster’s can’t be required to lurk. Having played with, modded, and watched, Blaster Master, this is how he plays. He disappears for long periods of time, makes a ton of posts when he shows up, and then disappears again. It can be frustrating, but it isn’t a scum tell, it is a Blaster tell. Voting for him is not going to push him to post more, we will do that when he shows up or Story will replace him. We have a lot of good information to work with. There is no reason for anyone to waste a vote on the ultimate in null tells.
Subjective over-simplification #2, and a wholly preposterous thing to say in regards to Day 1.
Subjective judgement #3. “Ignoring” the confirmed scum is apparently more scummy than lurking one’s ass off.
So amrussel “only had one or two suspicious posts”, but my two posts (made within 2 hours of each other) is a “series of attempts to move the lynch away from Macey”? Of course you’ve already said that basically any posts that did not overtly cast suspicion on Macey and/or support his lynch were “by definition” protecting Macey, so I’m not sure if your counting my vote switch from Jsexton to BLaM as part of this “series”.
Except the vote of mine that you’re referring to was for Jsexton, which is who Hockey Monkey then voted for as well. Also, Hockey called her own vote a “me too” vote, and yes it did strike me as odd, and it still does. Other people have noticed Hockey’s “me too” vote as well, though I can’t help but notice that you’re not dragging her non-Macey-centric posts out into the harsh light of attempting to protect Macey.
Funny you should use the word preemptive, because that is how I see your Day 1 post #184. Now with Macey in trouble and scum, I did indeed set myself up for this little gambit that I think you’re running, and I think you started cultivating it with this post. If Macey actually goes to the gallows, I’m the contingency plan, or at least in the pool of potential targets for the contingency plan.
Which is it, two or three? Does bufftabby count as one of those? Since bufftabby is already (mostly) dead and confirmed as scum, you’re proposing that two scummies hung their asses out on the line as part of a very small minority that would stand out the next day if Macey happened to hang, while one is voting for the other to boot. Even if I didn’t already know my alignment, I would not be buying what you are peddling.
Story said votes were removed: with an unvote, or when the voter or votee is dead. So, yes, valid assumption.
Yeah, but he said that would be true if we had a 30some player game. I assumed that he meant if 30some, then lots of death…though that doesn’t exclude if 30some or 27, then lots of death. I suspect, though, that the extra roles were death-prone roles, which is what he meant.
I don’t necessarily think this is the case. Imagine this: the scum see my case. It, of course, means nothing but that I’m probably not vanilla. But they can easily twist that. Bufftabby jumps on, lays down the foundation for the case in such a way that anything I say could make her more certain. At two votes, I’m tied for the lead. Hawkeyeop notices, TF notices, there could be a real bandwagon. All that’s left to seal it is an argument from another angle, and there could be a real bandwagon going. And then DiggitCamara posts this:
And this:
Again, note how my defense is incorporated into the accusation, which weakens the integrity of any further defending I could make. And as the case starts to slip (admittedly, to another power role, but TF probably wasn’t pegged as a power role like I was by the scum at that time):
Granted, he does counter macey’s ridiculous counterarguemnt to my mason role…but considering how weak the counterargument was, that was a safe position.
Then he votes for a lurker with controversial ideas–both of which are common accusations, and both of which are often done by townies. Chucara might be a ‘safe’ candidate, that DiggitCamara is voting for so he can say ‘:shrug: He looked scummy.’ when he turns up town.
And today, he’s only said one thing, about the way the night kills unfolded, that’s already been posited.
.