When I was a teenager I took a girl to see Brazil on our third date. She was seriously disturbed by the movie. She dumped me three days later. Not sure if there was any connection…
I think the advice to be yourself, and not to try to change anything, is valid inasmuch as you do, as Elysian says, want the person to like you, not some fake and ultimately unsustainable avatar of yourself - but if your natural self includes being an overly serious, shy, retiring wallflower who doesn’t ask people out, gets clingy, and doesn’t know how to have fun, then you’ll be minimising your chances.
I would therefore clarify this advice by agreeing that you should “be happy with who you are” but also add “work on your confidence, humor and general cheerfulness”.
IMHO you should never ask women for advice about how to change your looks / manners / mannerisms / clothes or anything else about yourself, unless you’re already very confident about what you DON’T want to do/wear, and even then chances are only about 20% that you’ll get ANY useful advice (and the other 80% will be absolutely horrible).
Confidence. Changing your looks, dress, etc are all great, but if you don’t like the results it will shine through and all that won’t mean jack. If you go that route, make certain that you LIKE the changes. Be firm about things you like. You mentioned you like snazzy jeans? then don’t go dockers just 'cause your female friend likes them. If you have facial hair, make certain it is well groomed. You might want to try airbrushing it out on a photo program before shaving it off it you’ve had it for a while.
Here’s the thing, it sounds like you need to relax. You come on too strong, and are worrying about your technique instead of applying it effortlessly. It’s like the difference between practicing a martial art and applying that maneuver in the street. If you are concentrating on what you think you should be doing, even a tiny bit, it shows through and you lose.
Be casual, ask her out for a drink or coffee at first. Keep it real low key. Don’t offer to pay for everything necessarily. It helps if you can get a place that has someone to bring you the drinks, you can offer to cover the tab and see how she reacts. If drinks go well, ask her for a casual date.
this is obvious advice, but the basics are often what screw us up. Be the best you that you can be. Don’t try to be something your not.
I agree 100%. Getting advice from women might actually hurt you.
But anyway, you’re a bit like the apocryphal New Yorker who asks how to get to Carnegie Hall. The answer, of course, is “practice practice practice.”
Just approach 2 or 3 women every day and hit on them. You will naturally develop confidence and every other skill necessary to get dates.
I agree with this only a little bit. Shopping for clothes will allow you to procrastinate, putting off more important things. Also, it encourages a “build it and they will come” mentality. Women can get away with that attitude, i.e. dress nicely, look good, and plenty of men will hit on them.
But if you are a guy, unless you are extremely wealthy or handsome, you need to go out and approach women.
I disagree with this too. It’s hard to fake interest in stuff which you don’t find interesting. Besides, you want to have a girlfriend/wife who has at least some common interests with you.
Indeed, and for all the advice about smartening yourself up, I’ve had surprising success when specifically not taking care of my appearance. A few years ago, before I got married, I went to the pub “just for one” on a sloppy weekend, having not showered or shaved for a day, and ended up meeting and going home with a girl. I confess that due to this, recently I’ve taken to not bothering to shave - I have a goatee, but the rest of my face is often covered in stubble. I really don’t give a shit about what I wear: despite my age my casual clothes are almost always no-slogan t-shirts, hoodie tops and jeans from Gap, and Timberland walking boots. The exception I make is the hair - it can really change your appearance, so I always attempt the most flattering style possible.
(BTW, I realise I’m making myself sound like a stud. I’m not, I’m very insecure and am in this thread highlighting only the successes not the failures, of which there have been many. Also, I’m not actually trying to pick people up: I’m looking for the new Mrs Jjimm - it’s just it’s been kinda happening anyway in the past few months, and who am I to refuse?)
I totally have to third this. WHO are you trying to date? You sound average…likeable but average. Is the teacher you’re interested the cutest of all the teachers? Are the woman you approach all stunning and put together? If you look on line do you put in a criteria of perfect qualities?
I can comfortably say now when I was a bit younger I was a hotty. I am now old and bitter but that isn’t the point. If I had my choice of the attorney with the BMW, the muscian with the tight pants and talent or the school teacher that drives a decent car, you’re going to lose. However, see my friends over there who are not classic beauties but wonderful, charming and loving…they would love to go out with you. But you’re not asking…
Foxy40, question for you. Would you take the musician over the teacher, because the musician is likely poor. Maybe more fun, but financially not well off (unless they live with their parents like most of their friends, which I will NOT do) I’m looking at teachers who are generally cute, but not supermodel. She honestly could stand to lose about 10 pounds herself. I’m 26 and make almost 60k a year.
I look at some of the girlfriends my friends and it astonishes me. A lot of them live at home still even though they have a degree.
Well, I’m not Foxy40, but I can answer this one - I would go for the one with the biggest dick. HA! No, I’m kidding.
Actually I would go for the one that’s the most fun to be with. I make my own money - I don’t need a man to. And if you make almost $60K, I assume your teacher co-workers do too.
I think perhaps you’re falling into the trap of thinking that being ok looking and having a decent job is all you need to do and women will fall all over you. Additionally, a Mazda 3 is not really a chick magnet as far as cars go. I mean, it’s perfectly adequate, but not a chick magnet. Statements like that make me wonder if you’re being honest about your self-assessments and honest about the women you’re approaching.
Also, to echo what the other posters are saying, you really seem to be over thinking this. Women are not a bread recipe. You don’t just add ingredients and voila! you have a girlfriend. Women are people and like to be treated with respect and be made to feel beautiful even if they could stand to lose 10 pounds. Honestly, when you talk about this women you’re interested in it sounds like you’re incredulous that she’s not falling all over you. I mean, you make almost $60K a year! You only have 4 lbs to lose! You drive a Mazda 3! and she’s 10 lbs overweight! I mean, who does she think she is not finding you irresistible!?!?!
Anyhow, it sounds like she’s not the girl for you. Just start asking out other women you meet – Ms. Wonderful is probably just around the corner.
Respectfully, this is typical bad dating advice from a woman, assuming that I understand you correctly. For a guy, trying to become friends with a woman and then have the friendship blossom into romance is a really bad idea.
What will happen most frequently is that the guy will use up a lot of time and energy spending time with the woman, only to be told, in effect “I don’t like you in that way.” The guy may even end up slipping into the role of the “nice guy,” who spends time with the woman – at her convenience of course – while she complains to him about the most recent jerk who had sex with her and then stopped calling.
The guy could have used that same time and energy approaching 20, 30 or even 100 other women romantically and aggressively from the very start. There’s a pretty good chance that a few of those women will respond positively.
Okay, I am trying to add some jest to this post, mostly because women drive me bonkers. I don’t REALLY expect everyone to want me because of the aforementioned reasons. But one person would be nice…just one
I agree the problem is likely with me and a lack of funness / humour. I’m trying to get better at that. Still I would hope that some of the qualities I mentioned would at least get people more interested in me. I mean don’t people marry / date within their economic bracket most of the time? Maybe I am wrong.
Whatever, the time for excuses is over. Someone please teach me how to be fun. I am afraid to do spontaneus things because I don’t handle it well. I take things too personally (again dealing with it) I like to plan things beforehand. Maybe I should do something crazy, like skydive or do another backpacking adventure. What do you think?
Good on you. Self deprecation, the ability to laugh at/make a fool of yourself, and the ability to highlight absurdities you see in ordinary situations are all entertaining to others. Anecdotes about people you know or dumb things you have done are also good.
I’d call them an incidental to the “fun” part. Perhaps a baseline, the omission of which would be a disadvantage. Then again, look at the number of people who are useless Rons and still manage to be in relationships. Or as Ladder Theory has it:
Copious amounts of awkward silences are the absolute kiss of death for any date. Sometimes it takes some superficial chitchat to get people comfortable enough to figure out common interests. The best way to do this is to be aware of the current events and have some interesting things to say about them. It doesn’t take a ton of work, just a half-hour every morning reading the headlines.
Yes, I think you are wrong. Look, when you hang out with your buddies, you are a fun guy right? Maybe not the life of the part, but fun enough that they want to hang out with you.
The only difference with women is that you feel uncomfortable, self-conscious, and nervous around them so your natural funness/humour is inhibited. So there is no need to make yourself a more fun person. You just need to approach lots of women until you feel comfortable with them.
No you should not. Just start approaching women every day and don’t worry about the fact that you will crash and burn and feel a bit silly.
So far the chicks have liked my Mazda 3 though
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Invest in yourself to make yourself interesting to other people. Find some hobbies. Try acting, performing somehow. Try competing in something. You’d be surprised what activities interest women. I landed my current SO in part because I met her after playing in a Bridge tournament. She had never heard of anyone our age playing Bridge, and found that interesting. Go out. Meet people, male and female. Talk to them, learn from them. Use that knowledge with other people. How to be fun is a lifelong process, not some magic wand that someone waves over you. Ignore the women, focus on yourself. In that process, if you happen to meet an available woman, ask her out. If it doesn’t work out, learn from your mistakes. And you will make plenty. They are funny later, so write them down. Lather, rinse, repeat.
You come off as desperate. Desperation is a huge turn off. Women don’t like that. There’s a popular notion that you should act indifferent and distant (i.e be a dick) to women to make them more interested, and while that’s a misreading of the situation, it has an element that’s not off the mark.
The key is that you have to appear as though are already fine and whole as a person – it’s not so much that that women want you to be cold to them, it’s that they don’t want you to be needy. Sending gifts too early, getting lovey dovey after one or two dates – that’s also a turn off. It sends a message that you’re invested in the idea of getting a girlfriend, but that any girlfriend will do. Moving too quickly makes it impersonal. In their minds you don’t even know them, so how could you be so smitten already.
Don’t try so hard and don’t be needy. When I say that, I don’t just mean don’t appear needy, you actually have to figure out how to be comfortable and content as you are without lfeeling as though you need a partner to complete you.
Here’s another piece of advice. Really get to know women as people. Not as dating prospects or sexual objects. Don’t view a date as a means to an end, but as an end in itself. The desperate, lonely guy vibe ironically turns women off for some of the same reasons as a womanizer does – because they aren’t seeing the women they court as individuals but as interchangeable targets. You have to shut that hunting mechanism right down. Learn who a woman is first. The more you really listen to, and understand and relate to a woman as an individual person (not as an interchangable target), the more responsive she’s going to be in return.
If I had to put it all on an index card, I’d put it like this. Show that you’re interested in her company, but act as though sex hasn’t even crossed your mind.
And for God’s sake, don’t send gifts to women at work. I don’t even do that with my wife (ok, maybe some flowers on our anniversary, but that’s it).
I don’t really get this part. I mean, I see that appearing needy is bad. But doesn’t the mere fact that you are asking for a date tacitly indicate that you feel the need to have a partner?
Maybe I’m just even more clueless than I thought, if that is possible…
Mmm, I would say the difference is between “having a partner would be nice” and “I need a partner and cannot be happy without one.” You want to be the guy on a wine-tasting tour deciding which bottle of he’d like to buy to take home, not the jittery alcoholic grasping for the cheapest case at 7-11.
What Tracy said. It’s not asking for a date, but how you act on the date. You have to show that you’re not thinking past that one date or that you’re in a hurry to get anywhere. I’m telling, chicks can smell desperation a mile away.
