Poll: Would you feel this was appropriate?

Imagine this scenario: A close friend of many years who enjoys flirting a lot has a joke advert on an IM chat program searching for a girl to take out for Valentine’s. So the incredibly hot girlfriend of our story’s hero, who gets along really well with said friend, jokingly asks him if he would take her out and what would he do with her. So the friend answers “probably take you out for a MacDonald’s dinner and then some crazy wild sex like there’s no tomorrow. Or maybe just skip the dinner and jump straight away for crazy wild sex” (making the girlfriend a tad unconfortable by the way). Would you feel this was an appropriate answer?

In my imaginary scenario, our hero is not amused and confronts in a civil manner the friend of many years, saying that he feels that’s taking the joke way too far and he doesn’t appreciate that kind of exchange. Said friend then proceeds to blow a gasket and huff away never to be heard of again.

I’d probably say something like “not cool, dude. Not cool.” Most of my friends would know I wasn’t pleased and back away.

A similar thing happened to me, actually. One day we were drinking a few beers and playing some cards. My buddy got pretty drunk and when my girlfriend mentioned her water bra, my buddy took it upon himself to start squeezing her boobs. Okay. 1 squeeze to feel a water bra, I’ll allow (as long as my girlfriend doesn’t mind). He kept doing it until I said “dude, c’mon. That’s my girlfriend.” He immediately looked embarassed, blushed, and stumbled away. I can’t imagine a confrontation with a “friend” escalating much past that.

Thank you. I should add that Hero wasn’t present when this conversation took place.

Even allowing for the fact that he was a bit tense when he confronted Friend after mulling it over for a while, I think his feelings should be respected and the matter amicably resolved right then and there.

Touching a boob without a written invitation, that’s a big no-no for me though. Kudos to you.

Oh, you weren’t there at the inappropriate comment? That may change things, to be honest with ya.

He was joking, right? I mean, you don’t think he was hitting on her or something? He was probably trying to be funny, and said something stupid. He also probably noticed she didn’t like it and was a little embarassed.

Confronting him hours or even days later means that your girl was bothered enough to tell you, and you were bothered enough after all this time to mention it to him. Over a silly joke he may already be regretting he made. While I would be the type of guy who would say “yeah, I shouldn’t have said that”, I know at least a couple of my guy friends would blow their top because they don’t like being called out on a mistake they know they made.

Sometimes its better to let things like this go. I thought you mentioned it to him immediately after the fact, which would have been better. You don’t owe him an apology or anything silly, but I think I probably would have just let this one go.

Yeah, both his sex comment and the overreaction to being confronted were inappropriate. Sounds like he could benefit from slowing down and thinking a bit more before he speaks up.
I also think it was a little inappropriate for the girlfriend to take the conversation down that road in the first place. If you’re a reasonably attractive girl (much less “hot”), it is risky to bring up the idea of dating with your platonic male friends if you don’t want to risk putting “the wrong idea” in the guy’s head.
That’s the problem with flirting just for fun…it is very easy for it to be taken the wrong way.

Yes, it was supposed to be a funny. She was taken by surprise and laughed it off, he did too.

I was bothered alright. Because he’s my friend and he was making inappropriate jokes at my girlfriend! My GF told me the same day (“you know this and that happened, it was a bit unexpected”) when we met and I “confronted” him shortly after. I wasn’t aiming for confrontation, just clearing the air. If he regrets it then he should have said so. He didn’t say much or stick around very long, just acted very, very offended, which I thought was really immature. I wasn’t looking for an apology, just making my feelings on the matter clear to him and I expect him to respect that.

I mentioned it as soon as I got the chance. I really value my true friendships and believe in talking shit over and that’s why I did it. Because I don’t want to hold grudges at my friends over silly things like an IM conversation. It’s up to him now, I don’t have any regrets, I was really just looking for some opinions from random strangers.

Err… Who instigated this again? :dubious:

I’ll admit your friend acted a little asinine when you confronted him but jeez I think both of you need to lighted up.

I can’t tell you how many times my friends have flirted with past GFs of mine.

I even had one buddy stick a cold beer mug between my GF’s tits because she was complaing that she was hot. (whe was wearing a low cut top btw.)

I respect your opinion but she was just being nice, it’s just her nature, she gets along very well with my friends and I like her for that. It wasn’t a flirt and he knew it. Besides that her comment played on the fact that he was stuck without any options other than to take his friend’s girlfriend out for Valentine’s, knowing it was just for company. He’s the one that crossed the line for me. Before this I would be confortable with him taking her out for a Valentine’s dinner or whatever but the idea would be to have a good time, not throw around sexual innuendos or even go way past that.

Read my previous post. And “instigated”? Give me a break. He’s accountable for his actions.

The word past was duly noted.

I would be fine with that. Or was that supposed to be a sugestion to have sex?

Pedro, compadre, you need to let it go. I’m ythinking about my friends of many years, and I think any one of them might say something like that, if not worse, to a girlfriend or wife of mine. I also know any one of them would eat his own left arm with onions before he laid a hand on her. Your friend was probably angry that you think he would ever try anything n your girlfriend.

What you say is true, I think he just saw it as an opportunity to drop a clever line and I’m sure he wouldn’t lay a finger on her, but I still don’t want him to do the dirty joke dance with her! Some jokes are harmless, some I shrug off, others make me unconfortable and undermine the trust in a friendship. This one is just plain disrespectful. I’m not like that to my friends and I certainly don’t like it when they are to me. Letting go when you have a bad taste in your mouth just comes back to bite you in the ass later on. I learned that the hard way. What would probably happen if I let go is that I would blow up sometime when he makes a harmless comment.

Yes, he is, but I don’t see that he did anything wrong THIS time.

Yes, that’s it. My past GF’s broke up with me because I wasn’t overly possesive or jealous. Because you know how girls hate that shit. :rolleyes: x’s infinity.

I don’t think your friend was seriouly sugesting it either.

If you’re really that worried about other people interacting with your “Very Hot girlfriend” Maybe you could just isolate her from all outside contact what so ever. That way you can be sure she’ll be yours forever. Or at least untill her looks fade.

Looks like you got one heck of a life’s lesson upon the horizon Pedro.

OK, sure, got it. I’m just gonna skip the pointless back and forth and chalk you up as an “appropriate”. I already said that I didn’t think he wasn’t serious about it but I understand that he was instigated, just like Oswald was instigated to shoot JFK. I guess you’re filling in today for the poster who just has to disagree that killing babies is wrong.

And go buy a sense of humor you twit. Obviously the comment about my GF being hot was tongue-in-cheek (but oh so true!).

I meant “didn’t think he was serious about it” of course.

I’m currious Pedro, you’re in your 20’s right? I can tell you’re getting a little peved calling me a twit in IMHO.

Let me tell you a little something about women dude.

Women, especially at that age, like to cause drama. Now I don’t know if they do this on purpose or if it’s just intrinsic.

The optimist in me hopes that it’s the latter.

I’ll give you a couple of my own personal examples:

Back when I had a room mate, he had a GF. As far as the apartment cleaning went we pretty much had an unwritten agreement that I did the day to day dishes and he took out the trash.

Now, my room mate definately got the better end of this deal. The only reason why it worked out this way is because doing the dishes after I get home from work was a way for me to wind down. (And yes I know that sounds odd)

Anyway, after a while my RM’s GF asked him in private why it’s always HIM that takes out the trash and how come I never do it?

Now, see this right here is inflamatory. What the fuck business is it of hers? She doesn’t live there, so why the fuck would she care? The only probable outcome for this is DRAMA! (which it caused no drama btw because he knew better)

example 2:

Again back when I had a RM I decided to quit smoking. MY RM did not. A female coworker of mine enquired about this and tells me I should MAKE my RM go outside to smoke.

To which I told her: “We didn’t agree to that when we signed the lease. So I’m not going to ask him to do it now”

Now again, why the fuck would she do that? If I were to actually go up to my RM and ask him that. What do you think would likely happen? like I said, it’s because women are all about the drama dude.

Maybe I’m sounding a little pajorative towards women. That’s not my intent. Maybe it’s just that emotions fly more freely from women and the above mentioned is just a side effect of that. Who knows?

So when you tell me you came home and she tells you it took her by surprize or whatever; it makes me wonder if she was just starting drama where there is none. Or even worse, trying to manipulate you to see if you take her as a priority over him. Which you should, but you shouldn’t have to "prove’ it in such an unsavory way.

When you portrayed yourself as a hero (even though I get you were kidding) it makes me feel as if you were pushed in the position of defending your ladies honor. Which you should have just said: “Honey, so-n-so has got diarea of the mouth. He’s my buddy, I know he didn’t mean anything by it. Just let it go this time ok?”

And then when you talk to your buddy; instead of acting like a boyfriend defending his girls honor; act more like his buddy and say something to the effect of: “Dude man, the ol’ lady’s get’n all weird on me about that comment you made earlier today… // …Yeah, yeah, I know you didn’t meant anything by it but still, try to whatch the crude talk around her because then I got to hear about it, ya know?”

Handled like that you could have avoided the whole situation.

I’m curious as to why your girlfriend didn’t issue the instruction to stop; was she incapacitated?

Yes, I’m in my 20s. I did get peeved because it sounded like you were just trying to be inflammatory. How can you not get this: it’s not about being overprotective of my GF. I’m not the kind of guy that likes to save damsels in distress. I let my GF speak for herself. I don’t play games with my GF and neither does she. Furthermore I’m able to judge situations on my own and if I think she is wrong I say so. My OP was about friendship. If having some boundaries I don’t let my friends cross makes me a possessive, jealous, insecure and shallow jerk so be it. One thing though, I’m not jealous of my PAST GFs either dude. That wasn’t a burn. Because, you know, past implies that they are no longer your GFs, so I don’t see how that is relevant to this situation.

I can see that your comments were influenced by your own experiences with women. But trust me, not every woman is like that and it’s a trait I dislike intensely.

She just related a conversation to me. That’s all. That’s communication and openness. It’s something mundane that happens every other day. I wasn’t trying to prove anything. I don’t even prioritize my GF over my friends, they’re both important, there’s no competition going on.

That was just a gag. Anyway there you have a point, I built up this situation (she tried to let it go).

Now that’s the kind of constructive comment I can appreciate. I wouldn’t lay the responsability on her because I was the one who was bothered by the whole thing. Still, that’s probably how it came off to him.

You are certainly entitled to feel that perhaps this joke was ab it over the top, though I personally disagree; especially if it was said with a straight face, thus implying a certain degree of deadpan humor in my mind.

However, I believe the important bit here is that while you may think the joke went a bit too far, I also think that you must realize that she put him into a situation where a joke was the only real option. The only question was what sort of a joke would it be. And of course as with all jokes, there is the possibility of the either joke falling flat or the audience deciding that there must “secretly be some truth there.” So basically, no matter what he said there would have been some sort of reply that might make you or your girlfriend feel uncomfortable. However, in the interests of education I will provide other possible scenarios.

Also, I will provide options, their downsides, and possible “hidden subtexts” that your or your girlfriend may pick up on; thus revealing the friends true feelings.
Think about it, she jokingly “asks him if he would take her out and what would he do with her.”

Would you prefer he say, “Well first I’d take you out to dinner at such and such for a romantic meal, then we’d walk along the beach and watch the fireworks before we head to my place where I have prepared the room with candles, wine and roses.” or something along those lines? This could still be a good joke depending on the relationship between the two of them and on his delivery but is exceptionally vulnerable to backlash if taken wrong?

Hidden Subtext 1: I’m a hopeless romantic who has been pining for you for years and who secretly thirsts to provide you with overblown romantic cliches.
Hidden Subtext 2: I’m gay. I have no desire to see you naked and cannot comprehend of a romantic relationship with you and therefore am using material from a movie I saw once.

Or, he could have just taken the ‘safe’ route and reply to her “joking manner” with a serious “No I wouldn’t take you out. Your my friends girlfriend.” Which probably would have killed the mood and left her feeling rather awkward and embarrassed at having been taken seriously.

Hidden Subtext 1: I protest too much. Your comment, though in jest, flies to the heart of my secret desires. I know I have no chance so I deny it all but you have no idea how much it paints me to hear you joke about this.
Hidden Subtext 2: I have no desire to sleep with you. I do however want to nail your boyfriend. I’ve just been waiting to have a boy’s night out and get him drunk enough to bend over my couch. It’s paisley by the way. The couch I mean.

What else? There’s always the simple, “Dinner and a movie.” Which, could still be delivered in a facetious manner but has the same risk as the first example of being taken as an honest proposal. The difference is that the first example is farther “over the top” and thus has a little more protection, though in both cases the potential for backlash is high.

Hidden Subtext 1: I am irritated by your shameless desire for attention you prancing bitch and thus, I choose to put no effort into my reply. Frankly I wouldn’t dignify your hopeless fishing attempt with a remark at all by your boyfriend is my buddy so to keep the peace I have to say something.
Hidden Subtext 2: I want you. I want you bad. I know that if I could only get you to watch the Seventh Seal with me, later at dinner I could so dazzle with my knowledge of Bergmen to the point where you would ditch your boyfriend and immediately drop to your knees under the table.

The last two main options involve an “over the top” positive or negative reply. The reason for exaggeration is to put both options out of the range of realism and thus keep emotions from getting bruised.

Here they are. Number One, the negative, “You? Hell no, you’re nasty.” In this case of course, the joke is that your gf is actually hot and they both know it. The downside is that people can be very self-conscious and your girlfriend my be deeply offended. There is also a second variant to this which goes a little more like, “You? Hell no, you’re nasty. How could I ever get it up for those perky breasts and firm hiney. I prefer my women with a little more sag. You know, something I can really swing from to remind me of my days at the playground.” This alternate also has a downside in that you or your girlfriend may be deeply offended by the fact that he noticed her perky breasts and firm hiney. Naturally, there are further pitfalls to be found in the subtext.

Subtext 1: Yeah, yeah. You have a nice body and when I first met you I thought you were good looking. That was of course before I realized what an evil skank you are… You’re a bitch and I’ve been wanting to say that for months. Frankly, you’re so much of a bitch that just the sight of you causes me great pain and I cannot conceive of how I ever found you attractive. I am just grateful for this chance to insult you to your face while camouflaging it as a joke.
Subtext 2: Yeah, Yeah, you’re nasty baby. Oooh, yeah I bet you are. You wanna get nasty with me? Yeah, yeah I bet you do. Oh yeah baby I love when you do that. You nasty, nasty girl.

Finally, we have option your friend took. Dinner at McDonald’s followed by wild monkey sex. This has the advantage in that it has elements of both “positive” and “negative” exaggeration. For the negative, we have dinner at McDonald’s. This is pretty much universally known as, “Not the way to get a women” in that it simultaneously involves being a] cheap b] classless c] giving no thought at all to what the women might want. This is followed immediately by the suggestion of wild monkey sex. The humor here is that this sort of attempt would generally be considered laughably inept and thus, funny if proposed in a properly deadpan or earnest fashion.

As with all of the options though, there are many subtexts of which I will give you only two.
Subtext 1 [which you discovered]: I secretly lust after you and am attempting to use humor to convey my real desires and one day nail you over my paisley couch.
Subtext 2: I dig clowns. I really dig clowns. Clowns are hot. I want you to put on a red nose, an orange wig and walk all over me with big floppy shoes while you smear me with dipping sauces.
All in all, SHAKES said it best. It was a joke. Sometimes jokes go a bit too far. Sometimes people misjudge their audiences. Your best option is to be briefly annoyed and let it pass. If it seriously bothers you or your girlfriend, the next best option is to use the approach SHAKES suggested. Don’t put him on the defensive.

Anyway Pedro, I just previewed and saw that you already noted SHAKES method for dealing with the situation [which, once again I believe is the way to go] so most of this post is totally unnecessary. In any case, I enjoyed writing it so I’m going to go ahead and post it.

Thank you Dubious Weasle. There were other ways to deal with it without being awkward (off the top of my head “seeing as you’re dating my buddy, I won’t bore you with the details” or “of course I wouldn’t take you out, a dinner and a movie is not really what I’m aiming for here” or even the simpler ball back in the other court “hey is that a proposition?”) but that was an interesting post nevertheless.

Good point. Your friend could have found a more graceful wait out of the situation, either by avoiding the set-up or choosing a more tasteful joke. Still, given that she was joking to him and that she brought up the topic I feel it wasn’t unreasonable for him to have replied in a joking manner.

Me personally? In his place I personally would have replied in a flat tone and with a straight face, “Butt sex.”

But that’s just me.