norinew, you’re in my thoughts. Mental illness is devastating. It is so hard not to be angry. I wish you peace.
Well, we’ve refused to let her move back in here. We’ve refused to give her cash for years now. Her last trip to the psych hospital that was over an hour away, we didn’t go visit her at all. We went once, when she was almost ready to be released, for a requested “family session” with her counselor (and I did not mince words or sugarcoat anything for that session). If you mean we could have cut her out our lives completely before this, I guess you’re right. As I said, my husband didn’t really want to, because he had hoped she might come around. And there’s enough conflict with her, we don’t need conflict between him and me. Do you see something you think we should have done that we didn’t do? If so, please point it out, so we can see if it’s an option now. I’m certainly not saying we’ve made no mistakes. Kids don’t come with an owner’s manual.
As cavalier as she is about sex and protection, we’ve pretty much reached the conclusion that she must not be very fertile, thank Og. You’re absolutely right she would use kids as a bargaining tool.
This illustrates one more reason why it’s a bad idea to take her with us if she’s not stable. She loves an audience, and we’ll be with my family Christmas Eve, and hubby’s family Christmas day. I don’t know that she’d be able to resist the temptation of having a meltdown in front of so many potential sympathizers! :rolleyes:
Thanks for the hugs! They really do help.
And thank you, Ghanima, for your words of support.
I’m interested in this ongoing story as well. I don’t know how you do it, norine. I get stressed about my stepkids sneaking out of the house at night and they haven’t even gotten in trouble. (Yet. That I know of.) I’d like to offer some advice or comfort here, but I don’t know what to say.
I was expecting this thread to be an announcement that you’re going to be a grandmother.
I’m so sorry this stuff is still causing your family so much pain. I have no useful advice, though god knows I wish I did
Simple. I don’t have a choice.
Well, thank Og you were wrong about that! 
Opal, as far as I can tell, there is no useful advice (smacking her around would be cathartic, but not useful, per se). Support is just about all I could ask for. Thanks.
I’m sorry to hear that the drama continues. I think the kindest thing you can do for her and for the rest of the family is to keep firm limits. It may be the only way to maintain a reasonable relationship with her.
I have some broken family members, too. I’m sorry for your pain.
Sometimes I think the reason I’ve never had kids is because I was afraid of a scenario like this. I’m proud that you’re protecting your other kids as best you can from your daughter’s insanity.
At this point, I’m not sure that there can be a “reasonable relationship with her”, and of course, that’s her choice. I know she’ll yell and scream about how hurt she is that we’ve withdrawn our offer for her to come with us for Christmas, but, oh well. So far, setting limits hasn’t worked. I’m hoping I’m wrong, but it really is starting to look like we may have to just. . .distance ourselves from her. She hasn’t left us many options.
lisacurl, thanks for the kind words. Quite honestly, if I’d known my first child would turn out like this, I don’t know what I would have done. Of course, if I hadn’t had my first one, I wouldn’t have my other two, either, and as I’ve said, they’re delightful. Of course, that line of thinking always makes my head explode, so I try not to do it too often.
I wish I could help, or at least offer useful advice. I’m right there with the political-philosophical soapbox when I see an opportunity, seems like I ought to be able to contribute something alternative or progressive.
Actually, my sister is seriously starting to slide into that general category, both for me and for my parents. (And at 72, dammit, they’ve done their time and should not have to be doing Parenthood Redux with either of us middle-aged kidlings!). I don’t know what to do about her either. When someone doesn’t perceive themselves as having a problem (or as having a problem that does not consist of “my life unfairly sucks and you people owe me”), and the only help they’ll accept is of the “enable me” flavor, sometimes the only thing you can do is protect your own backside.
Sympathy from here. And I think we all want to hear what’s going on so we know how you’re doing, so don’t worry about that.
(((((norinew))))))
Your problems with your daughter make our problems with Ivyboy pale in comparison. (I think I may have some good news about him in a couple of weeks, but I don’t want to jinx it, or hijack the thread.) I wish I could wave a magic wand and make all kids stellar students who walk grandmothers across the street and volunteer in soup kitchens.
This must be an incredibly hard decision for you. But, she is an adult, and you can’t keep being her safety net, not when you have two other children. Let her go, but for Og’s sake, if she comes up pregnant, get that baby away from her.
Exactly. Just about everything she says boils down to why nothing is her fault. I’m sure she’ll have lots of “reasons” this time, too. But frankly, I don’t have much sympathy left for her.
Oh, yeah. She asked me once if she had a baby would I try to have it taken out of her custody. I told her that if I thought she wasn’t a fit mother, she could bet her ass on it.
norinew, thanks for the links, I appreciate it.
Many kudos for staying sane and happily married, and successfully parenting your other two daughters, at the same time OD’s drama has taken so much focus.
For what it’s worth, if she ever turns herself around, a lot of those things you’ve been trying to teach her may turn out to have taken hold after all.
Like I said earlier, my little sister was filled with rage, not neediness, but she directed most of it against our parents, like OD seems to. They were THE WORST PARENTS EVER and yes, they did lie awake at night plotting ways to make her miserable. She said some deeply hateful things and blamed them for everything – all while they were doing their level best by her, in much the way you have. When she finally grew out of that phase in her mid 20s, she started to come around about the folks. Now, in her mid 30s, she’s apologized to them and really means it. She’ll tell anyone who listens what great parents they were and how rotten she was as a teenager. Even better, she now lives by the ideals my parents worked so hard to instill in her, and has most (not all!) of the good habits they tried so hard to teach, too. I would not have believed it possible when she was 18. Best of all, she figured out how to use her powers of rage for good, not evil – she’s the world’s best victim’s advocate (social worker) if you ask me.
My heartfelt wishes for better things to come for all of you. My special sympathetic vibes to your other two daughters – I know how frustrating it can be.
Oh, look, more attention and drama!
Here’s hoping her eggs are hiding in her Fallopian tubes and are refusing to come out.
norinew, I’m so sorry and I wish I could say something more worthwhile then that. You story just tells me some kids have problems, issues, maybe genetic, maybe from birth, who knows. Nothing a good parent does will help untill they help themselves. Good on you to show your younger sweet kids you won’t let the whole family get sucked into the eldest’drama.
emilyforce, I think my husband has been afraid that if we distance ourselves from her completely that if she does every turn herself around, she’ll hate us for deserting her or something. But like I said, he’s sick of it now, and ready to throw in the towel. I think if she ever comes around (and I do understand she may), she’ll realize that we’ve realistically done all we can.
Heh. You got that right! Hell, they’re probably terrified of her underwear! Seriously, one of her. . .issues. . .is lack of hygiene. In fact, when she went into rehab the first time, they actually called me to see if she had intestinal dysfunction because her underwear was so shit-stained. :eek:
People always say “Don’t worry that your kids don’t listen to what you say; worry that they watch everything you do”, but honestly, I don’t know where this lack of hygiene comes from. Her father and I shower daily, etc. Hell, sometimes her father showers twice daily! But in order to let her come with us for Thanksgiving, I felt compelled to tell her straight up that she would shower the night before, and wear properly fitting clothes. She tends to wear clothes that are at least three sizes too small. And if she loses weight and drops a couple of sizes, she’ll wear clothes that are even smaller. LeSigh.
Maastricht, thank you for the kind words! 
I’ m sorry to hear this. I had a sister who (in retrospect) was likely mentally ill, but also a brittle diabetic from age 8. She was very manipulative, tried to get money out of everyone (including a great uncle–retired, with kids and grandkids of his own), stole another sister’s identity–you name it, short of prostitution and drug abuse, she did it. (well, no murder, but still). She died young–she was 41. Very frankly, it was a relief to all when she died. I miss the sister I knew when we were very young–not the unstable, unpredictable person she changed into upon hitting her late teens, early 20s. She called the police on my parents one Christmas for no reason (we were all home–nothing had happened to her, who knows what she was thinking). My parents weren’t the greatest parents in the world, but she was a piece of work.
I do hope your daughter hits bottom and straightens out, but I completely understand and agree with the letting her go. I do most sincerely hope she does not ever have a child. And I’m sorry for that as well… Just a bad situation all around.