Sometimes everything is fine if you go through the laundry list of qualities, but there is just no chemistry. Nothing to learn for next time. You were witty, charming, and cute, but not the right kind of cute and it just didn’t feel right. There’s not necessarily anything to learn.
I went on one date with a girl and, on paper, everything was great. We had the same interests, tons in common, similar senses of humour. And she was pretty hot in her photo, and she thought I was cute too. When we met… Meh.
She looked just like her photo, and was cute. We got along fine and had a decent time, but… Meh. She looked at me like she was thinking “Meh.” too.
No second date. Nothing to learn there either. There was nothing wrong with her, she just wasn’t a good match, and for no particular reason. She never called me again, I never called her again, the universe is in harmony.
(adds Bridget Burke to list of those who can snidely remark but not answer a question)
Wow … am I ever angry now. If anyone knows it, it’s obviously someone on a message board. Why, just look at how angry I am. :mad:
Perhaps restating the question may help ease my anger since it’s clearly an issue I need to come to terms with. With a little luck, I can get an answer from a woman who doesn’t have internet forum psychoanalysis on her to-do list. The question I’m putting forth is why a woman would string a guy along if she had no real interest. This assumes more than a few dates, more than a few phone calls, and a mutual exchange of respect and perhaps even intimacy, only to make insulting excuses later on for not getting together, rather than just coming out and saying "I’m just not that into you". If she’s JNTIY, why wouldn’t she just say so (or alternately, stop returning calls) instead of bothering with excuses that prolong the inevitable? It only makes her look like an idiot, insults the guy, and perhaps even gives him the wrong idea if he’s a bit clueless. This in turn leads to him calling her more if he doesn’t get the hint, which is something she obviously doesn’t want. I don’t think it’s too much to ask for a girl to share a thoughtful answer or story related to this question rather than a condesceding pscyh eval. The question is a fair extension of the topic. I thought I knew the answer, but as the Women Against Misogyny are fond of pointing out, my view on reality is warped by the anger and emotional immaturity that come with the clinical online diagnosis of my obvious psychosis.
Nevertheless, I’ve yet to hear a woman’s answer that isn’t the “She’s Just Not That Into You” chorus line from Sex And The City being sung here, which doesn’t apply to the situation I’m exemplifying in the first place. Yes, that’s right, the line was popularized on Sex And The City by Samantha’s character, except that it was “he’s just not that into you”. I know because I watched Sex And The City, so perhaps my barely-contained misogynism and unattractive anger stems from my obvious closeted homosexuality!
Wow. Somebody needs a big steaming cup of get over yourself. anamnesis, there’s a very good reason some women don’t give courtesy calls. They’re didn’t want to. Just like guys who do that. Get it now? They met someone else, they decided at the last second they didn’t want to bother, they changed their minds, they entered a nunnery, they decided you’re a stalker…insert BS excuse of your choice. It’s a shitty thing to do regardless of gender. Move on.
Based on your persona on this messageboard, I’d guess that you passed for a Nice Guy for a short while, and then your tendency toward rather hateful behavior probably scared her away. You’ve described stalker-like behavior. You’ve described deliberate obnoxiousness when you don’t get your way. You have stated contempt for women.
Yet you probably think you’re swell and a real catch and that any woman who doesn’t want to spend time with you is rude and just missing out.
And here’s the kicker: I’m answering your question, the same way the OP wants his questions answered. Yet, you’ll come back and say that, “Oh, women never tell me what’s wrong. Oh, women always just stop returning my calls. And I’m such a Nice Guy!”
If you are anything, ANYTHING like your posts, you are not a nice guy. That is the answer. That will always be the answer.
After one date? No. Definitely not. After a few, during which some intimacy is established? Yeah, it kinda is. I mean, I get that their reasons are their own, and I don’t think they should have to detail them, but “I’m not interested” isn’t much of a courtesy to ask at that level*.
*GENERALIZATION! Meant to apply to regular people you just don’t want to go any further with. Does not apply to cases of “(S)he’s a stalker/psycho/total asshole, and I cannot have any further contact with this person, ever.”
I am assuming you asked in good faith so I will answer in the spirit with which it was intended. if you would like further clarification, please ask for it, in the spirit with which I am offering it.
The answer is because “no real interest” is not as unproblematic as you make it out to be. “No real interest” can imply:
There’s nothing overtly wrong with him and I enjoy his company but I know this relationship isn’t really going anywhere
There are some things I like about him and some things I don’t; it took a few dates to see how they balance out
I like him a whole lot but there are a few things about him I really don’t; it took a few dates to realize that I can’t live with those things
I thought I really liked him but as it turns out I don’t and I can’t explain why
I like him a lot but we don’t want the same things out of a relationship right now (e.g. I want to date casually and he is planning the wedding)
I like him a lot but we don’t want the same things out of life (e.g. I work at a job that pays crap but is spiritually fulfilling, volunteer extensively and am very politically active; he works at a job that pays spectacularly well but is spiritually deadening, spends most of his spare time playing World of Warcraft and drinking scotch, and has never and will never vote)
I liked him a lot until I realized that he reminds me exactly of an ex-boyfriend that I don’t have pleasant memories of, and it’s just a bit too creepy
These are all perfectly good reasons to break it off that are extremely difficult to communicate to someone at the best of times, let alone while you are breaking up with them. None of them (I feel) would provide any satisfying closure to the dumpee. Most dumping situations require a lot of ego-massaging even at the best of times. To try to simultaneously engage in thoughtful discussions of what boils down to the philosophy of personal preference (or, perhaps, subjects of profound emotional significance that may not be any of the dumpee’s business) is just too much to bear.
I can only speak from experience but I generally find that when I don’t call somebody back after a couple of dates there is a reason for that and it doesn’t always need to be discussed. More than once I have been on date #3 or #4 and he drops a bombshell right in the middle of a conversation.
“Isn’t that a beautiful sunset? Almost as beautiful as the sunrise. I should know since I haven’t worked in 8 months and have had plenty of time to watch the sun rise and set.”
“What a beautiful necklace. Does that symbol mean you are Jewish? Oh, you’re pagan? That’s cool. My dad is a baptist minister and he will never accept you as a part of my life ever. He might actually start throwing bibles at you. We can still go out though, that’s cool.”
“Oh you have a cat? I think women who have cats are pretty pathetic individuals. Not that I am saying that about you, of course, but you know…”
“So how many kids do you want to have someday? What do you mean you don’t ever want to have kids? Why wouldn’t you want to have kids? I want to have at least 6 someday.”
Telling a guy that he is an asshole for saying such-and-such or it creeped you out when he said whatever is never fun or beneficial for anyone. He will deny it or say you took it out of context or that he can change, blah blah blah. Sometimes not calling someone back is the nicest option you have.
I’ve been wondering about this myself. I’m not talking about “no chemistry” dates, either; as several others have said, those are pretty recognizable. I’m thinking of a couple of dates where you seem to get along great, you’re terrific, he’s terrific, and then suddenly he never calls you again. OK, so he’s just not into me, but I still wonder why.
I think everyone in this thread is in agreement that if there is a mutual lack of chemistry, there doesn’t need to be any further investigation in the event of a non-callback. I even mentioned an example of this in the OP.
I think some people are also replacing the word ‘curiosity’ with ‘emotional neediness’. Let’s lay off the labels and broad brush strokes, people. There also seems to be a gender divide here- and I’m seriously wondering if some women weren’t the least bit curious on why ‘he never called me back’.
If they don’t call back, as people have said, chances are its not someone You/Me/etc would be interested in anyway. Nobody is under any obligation to call back. But I am entitled to my opinion when I say it is rude to do so.
If I were to go on a date with a woman, have zero interest in her but tell that she was infatuated with me,I would tell her how I felt. I don’t need a potential phone stalker calling me at 2 AM desperately trying to impress/seduce me (Had one in high school, one is enough thank you). Personally, I would think if I said nothing, that gives a needy/desperate person more of an excuse to pester me.
It’s possible, in fact I think it’s probable, that more confident people than I have posted in this thread. Perhaps they can just shrug off rejection easily, but I still haven’t learned to do that. I’m much better at it now, and can take an attitude of, “Well, he/she won’t know what they’re missing,” and go on my merry way. But I still wonder. I am curious by nature anyway, and since it’s a personal matter, I’m even more curious.
Sometimes I think I’m the only woman who has wondered that. But then again, maybe I just hang with really confident chicks.
I don’t think it’s a matter of confidence so much as pragmatism. He never called me back, he’s not that into me. It doesn’t especially *matter * why. I might briefly wonder, but I’m certainly not going to spend my limited time on this earth agonizing over it, and I’m DEFINITELY not going to chase him down for answers, because they aren’t worth as much to me as my dignity is.
It might also be a function of age. I’m 36 years old. I’ve been in happy, successful relationships with happy, successful people. I KNOW that there’s nothing egregiously wrong with me, and also that my overall fabulousness doesn’t, by any stretch of the imagination, mean that *everyone * is going to love me. A guy I went on three dates with has nothing to teach me about myself, and his opinion is not the measure of my worth as a human being.
Of course I’m curious. But in this, like in many areas, I am usually happy to be agnostic - I know that the answer is unattainable, and even if it’s attained, I know it won’t make me feel any better. “Oh! You think I’m a bore! You don’t like my tits! You got back together with your ex!” None of these would make me feel one bit better to hear. In fact when I imagine the conversation when he tells me why he’s not calling me back, it ends up with me making excuses and pleading and promising to change - precisely what I know won’t work. Why would I want to put myself into that situation?
The most positive breakups I’ve ever had have been the ones where reasons were not explained. Reasons are always ugly, and I can’t see any reason to pour salt onto those wounds.
I think the only “reason” that would make a lot of dumpees feel better is “I’m breaking up with you because I am a stupid selfish asshole/bitch.”
Have you ever done that? They stalk you anyway. If she was stalkerish to begin with, being Mr. Upfront won’t change anything. So there you’ll be, stomping on this little puppy and watching her dissolve into a puddle of tears. Or she’s doing the sniffle thing. Or she’s taking it on the chin but starts trying to negotiate, it’s like that scene from Private Ryan when they’re going to execute Steamboat Willy. Fancy schmancy, go fly a kite. And you know this won’t be it if she’s the bugfuck stalker type, there will be phone calls. Tonight she’ll be ripped to the tits on schnapps and ringing that phone off the hook to tell you what a piece of shit you are. Or maybe she’ll wait a month then try you again to see if your circumstances have declined to the point that you’re reconsidering a position in her personal horror show. Because she thought you could, you know, just be friends, didn’t you say that at one point? Oh dear sweet monkeychrist, you did say that.
So you get to feel like a total prick for being honest and having a minimum chemistry requirement. She gets to experience the agonizing pain of personal rejection coupled with the renewed fear of cat lady status. She’ll never say thank you and you’ll regret the half hour that you’ll never get back. And if she was crazy to begin with she’ll still stalk you.
Or you could just not do it, wonder if she has your home address and let her do the math.
I can’t say it any better than DianaG. Who the fuck cares why they don’t want another date? There are tons of others who will and of those you will like some of them.
As my marriage was breaking up a couple of years ago, I was horrified at the prospect of dating, mostly because of perusing threads like this. Then I got in the dating world and found that it was kind of interesting and fun. I had a bunch of boring dates and quite a few fun ones and got laid a bunch and got stalked and made some platonic friends and mostly realized that it’s not that big of a deal.
There were a couple of women who turned me down when I asked them for a second or third date by just saying, “you’re nice but not for me” and one or two who didn’t reply to the email. Whatever. I didn’t think twice about it. Just move on to the next one. Why do you even care?
I don’t want to give anyone the impression that I can shrug off rejection. But for me knowing that I’ve been rejected is plenty of information. I’ve got enough hangups that I really don’t need to hear that someone doesn’t like my laugh, or thinks I’m unattractive. Unless I’m a chameleon, it doesn’t matter why they don’t like me, just that they do. The idea of “Tell me what I did wrong so I can change” is very uncomfortable for me. I don’t think that’s how people really do change or learn about themselves.
At least in my case, it’s because she doesn’t realize that she has no real interest for the first couple of dates. This happened to me recently. I was dating 4 guys - two of them we just sort of mutually stopped contact. With one of them we went out a few times, talked on the phone lots, etc. I like him. He’s a nice guy, he has a great sense of humour (laughs at all my jokes), fun, etc. etc. Why on earth would I not accept a second or third date with him? However, I’m just not that into him. I really WANTED to be into him, because he has all these great qualities, but I just can’t do it.
So there you go. And what am I supposed to say to the guy? I think you’re super, but you sort of remind me of my dad? You made a couple of innocent comments in the span of the hours that we’ve spent talking, that turned me right off? You seem like you’re treating our dates like a job interview - “auditioning” me to see if I’m an appropriate mate? I mean, none of these are sensible, changable things, right? But I’m just not going to be able to get past them and I don’t think anything would be gained by me trying to detail them. And, to be frank, despite the fact that he has asked me out multiple additional times, I don’t think he would actually much care (which is actually one of the “innocent comments” that really turned me off).
But that’s it. It’s not because I’m rude. Or a bitch. Or stringing him along. It’s because I really wanted to like him, and I don’t. So there you go.
Now, after this long, earnest answer, I have to join the chorus of “If you’re anything IRL as you are in this thread, that’s why women aren’t returning your calls.”
Seriously - every post you’ve made makes you sound…horrible, frankly.
Exactly. Why would you want to live your life according to someone else’s idea of what you should be? Not only do you stand a good chance of disliking who you become, there’s something very off putting about someone with so little self esteem that they’re willing to totally remake themselves according to specification.
Of course, there are people out there who enjoy doing the Machiavelli thing. I just don’t happen to be one of them. I need to respect my partner, and as Ferris Bueller said: “You can’t respect someone who kisses your ass.”
I don’t think that’s the point. I am not advocating this position, but consider it this way.
I may not be willing to change a minor thing for one potential date. But if I heard similar feedback after half a dozen abortive dates, then perhaps I do have ass’ ears.
First of all, the question you are positing now – several dates, several phone calls, maybe even intimacy – is not the same as the question the OP’er posited in the OP, which was “You go on a date, you think things go well, you like the person, you think they like you…then they never call back.” Your first post in this thread was in response to the OP and not to the very different situation you yourself have now theorized. That first response sounded hostile and blaming of the woman, to a degree that was out of proportion to the situation in the OP (woman doesn’t call back after one date). Now, you can consign me to the Man-Haters’ Club if you want, but it was not unreasonable for people reading this thread to assume you were responding to the OP and not to an entirely different and obviously much less defensible situation, like the one you’re theorizing now. Several dates + several calls + intimacy != one date.
Second of all, the most defensible reason to “string someone along” IMO is the hope that things will improve. He’s a nice guy, he’s not unattractive, we have a lot in common, why isn’t he ringing my bell? Maybe if we go out a couple more times a better attraction will develop . . . nope, three dates later, still nothing there. In that circumstance, I agree with you, to just drop someone (stop returning calls) is harsh and a frank “sorry, I’m just not interested in seeing you anymore” would be better. But people of both sexes avoid conflict and avoid unpleasant conversations so IMO someone who calls four or five times and doesn’t get a call back needs to buy a clue. If you want to call that cowardice, that’s fine; that’s compeletely in line with the “I’m better off without her anyway! She doesn’t know what she’s missing!” school of thought, which is IMO probably the least wounding way to get over the fact that someone you like apparently just doesn’t like you.
So I do think it’s a matter of how much of a “relationship” we’re talking about. IMO, one to three dates, that are not hot’ n’ heavy, not multi-hour “we’re really clicking” talk-fests, I don’t think a guy is entitled to an “I’m just not interested in you” conversation. In fact, I think that conversation in those circumstances would be kind of mean: making explicit something that shouldn’t need to be explicit. And believe me, continuing to call to demand an answer or to try to exhibit that you are really really interested is not attractive, it’s stalkerish.
I understand people who get the “Pass, not interested” responsible would like to know why. Certainly if I guy that I like doesn’t like me I wonder why. But that’s true of any “audition” process from dating to job-interviewing to trying out for a play or a team. But the truth is, if the answer is “no” then the answer is “no” and the why of it won’t change that. In this context especially, there’s no help in receiving that feedback, since it’s likely to be something you either cannot change (like how you look) or shouldn’t change (like your personality), and attraction is so subjective that if you did omit something because one person didn’t like it (“You talk to much”), you could easily find the next person didn’t like you because you didn’t do that very same thing (“You don’t talk enough, you just sit there”).
When are you entitled to a reason? When we’re talking about a break-up. That presumes the existence of a relationship. One to three dates is not a relationship. Even for a real break-up, you’re not entitled to anything more than “I’m sorry but I don’t want to see you anymore.” Harsh and completely suck-tastic? Yes. But long agonizing reasons for all your short-comings won’t make it any less so.
Nevertheless, I’ve yet to hear a woman’s answer that isn’t the “She’s Just Not That Into You” chorus line from Sex And The City being sung here, which doesn’t apply to the situation I’m exemplifying in the first place. Yes, that’s right, the line was popularized on Sex And The City by Samantha’s character, except that it was “he’s just not that into you”. I know because I watched Sex And The City, so perhaps my barely-contained misogynism and unattractive anger stems from my obvious closeted homosexuality!
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