Gee… if I’m getting to a door and there are people relatively close behind me, I’ll wait and hold the door. Nice to know there are people like you out there to react violently to it. :rolleyes:
(btw, thanks Johnny)
In saying militant I mean having very strong views on the subject that I’m not afraid to express. As you, obviously do, as well. Hmph.
Gee, women in Afghanistan can’t even leave the house without full body covering, women in the middle east are suffering from genital mutilation (ie, female "circumsisiom-sp?) and here we are upset because someone is opening a door for us?
The fuck?
Please tell me what went wrong!
I’m going to paraphrase what Sauron said, mostly because I’m pissy I didn’t see this thread til now 
Feminist: “You don’t have to open the door for me because I’m a woman.”
Average Nice Guy: “I didn’t. I opened the door for you because I’m a gentleman.”
Common civility is eroding bit by bit in this country, and I believe that it’s attitudes like those expressed in the OP that are assisting in this degredation. It amazes me that someone being NICE is pissing you off! What the hell are you THINKING?!
laughs Cause’ I’m not upset at all about THOSE things!
(for those of you who can’t detect sarcasm over the internet: HEAVY SARCASM)
But I figured I wouldn’t really have too many posters going: “Hey! We want more mutilation!” and I figured a conversation would be more interesting.
What the hell do you mean? When I’m on a date (heaven forbid), and I pull out a chair for her, or open a door, or run around a car to get the door for her, do you know why I’m doing it?
I’m not doing it because I’m excercising some superiority complex cause I’m a man. I’m not doing it to look down on my date.
Do you know why I’m doing it? I’m doing it because I’m On a friggin’ DATE! When people go on a date with each other, both parties put forth a bit of extra effort to be appealing to each other. Perhaps the girl will put on her good makeup, or wear a new dress, and the guy will complement that dress. Also, the guy traditionally holds the door and pulls out the chair. In all of these situations, each person is doing it to get noticed. A guy holds a door and pulls out a chair to demonstrate that he likes the girl, and notices her. He doesn’t just slump down into his chair and pretend that she’s not there.
These little things are a way of showing other people that you know they exist. Have you ever thought that the reason it’s become “common courtesy” is because it gets a good reaction? I doubt that if every guy who opened the door got “kicked in the nads” cause the lady took offense to it, I doubt it would be around much longer.
When I lived In Virginia, I had to get used to this standard of behavior–as well as the one that had men rising when a woman rose or entered the room. I liked it, frankly. Even if it did harken back to some time when it was done for reasons that might gall me today (weak female, lesser sex, exalted virgin/whore dichotomy, you name it).
For me, it became less a statement on how the man regarded me in terms of equality, and much more a statement on How His Momma & Daddy Raised Him.
But that’s just me. Now that I’m up in Michigan? I no longer expect it or judge the miscreants–er, I mean, fellow Michiganders–who don’t even consider holding a door for me. My husband wouldn’t get a door for me even if it guaranteed him a blowjob.
Well, wait, I take that last statement back.
If I stopped holding the door for women I would lose an oportunity to get a good look at their ass 
Seriously though I’ll probably always hold doors open for people because of the memory of my mom swatting me upside the head if I didn’t.
Wolfman, you make me sick!
Cause that’s what I was gonna say!
Oink
Please tell me this is a joke, or sarcasm, or hyperbole, or something. You would really repay the kindness of a stranger with physical assault? Whatever happened to practicing random acts of kindness? Or even not so random?
You know what? I’d rather risk the wrath of a stranger by doing something thoughtful and nice than have to live with myself as a person afraid or unwilling to extend a hand like I was taught by my upbringing.
I didn’t know people like this exisited. At the very least, a “no thanks, I’ve got it” still is within the bounds of common courtesy. You must be a walking horror.
Once, I offered an elderly woman my seat on the bus. “Do I look helpless to you?” she barked and then muttered something else under her breath that sounded a lot like “fucking bitch”.
At the time I just sat there in shock and fought the urge to cry. Much later I thought of what I should have said: “My mother raised me to have respect for my elders. Obviously you never learned good manners or you would have just said ‘No, thank you’.” (Well, either that, or “Do you kiss your grandkids with that mouth, you ungrateful hag?”)
That experience gave me insight into how gentlemen must feel when they do something they think is well-mannered (door-opening, chair-pulling-outing) and get abused for it. Unless a kind gesture is accompanyied by an overtly patronizing act (the aforementioned “there ya go, little lady” or an actual pat on the head), I think the person doing the random act of kindness should be giving some slack, if not gratitude.
While I can see your point, get off your fucking high horse. I hold doors for males and females–if I’m the first one there it’s the polite thing to do. If you want to read into it any feelings of superiority on my part then you are insane.
Drain Bead said:
And that’s what I expect. And expect me to say thank you.
**** said:
Yep.
You know, LaurAnge, jerks like you have consistently derailed the cause of feminism. Act nice and expect others to act nice and to NOT have hidden agendas and you will find this is a friendlier world. And, yeah, you can do that without coming across as some moronic Barbie Doll. Your paranoia is uncalled for. Guys, as a group, have been changed by the past few decades of constructive feminism. Get out of 1970.
screams at the top of my lungs
Do you people not read all the posts before replying or something???
Alright, this is the absolute last time I’m going to repeat this! I know it’s a fine line between courtesy and chivalry, but if you are opening a door just to be nice no matter who it is it’s GOOD. What I protest to is the principle of men opening doors for women out of chivalry!
Any questions?
(sorry, I’m in a bad mood tonight and my temper is much shorter than it usually is)
This thread reminded me of something. Years ago, I was home from college, watching my sister get ready for Homecoming. Her best friend was there, and it had been agreed that their dates would pick them up at our house. My mom was helping them, fluttering about, all excited for the “big date”. She had the camera all ready to go.
I will never forget the horror on her face when the boys pulled up in the driveway, honked the horn and waited for the girls to come out. Needless to say, they were forced to come inside and pose for pictures.
Okay LaurAnge,
You’ve made it clear enough but I just don’t understand how you can tell the difference. Have a bunch of guys open the door for you, then let it shut in the face of the guy behind you? Or have a bunch of guys said ‘I’m only opening the door because you’re a weak woman incapable of opening it your self’. Or it it just some magical ability to tell if the guy is holding the door open out of malice.
Quite simply, I hold the door for everyone. Once in a while there is that true prince (or princess) who after watching me keep station for five or ten people will wrench the handle out of my grasp and take over for me.
I just refuse to imagine a world without manners. They will always be cool, period. As a male, I also have a mile wide protective streak for women and children, but some things just make too much sense.
Just as living well is the best revenge, to live that way demands that you lead by example. Virtue is its own reward. Sometimes it’s hard to remember that, “Duty done is the fireside of the soul.” There’s just no other way to look in the mirror without flinching.
So many women and men alike have risen to protect what I consider to be nothing less or more than good manners. Please bring your most or least favorite list of things about liberation and chivalry to this thread.
I don’t act differently towards anyone who holds a door to me, be man, woman, frog etc. But I can ASSUME that some men do open it for me 'cause I’m a woman (since, by some strange coincidence, it’s all men) and lots of men own up to it.
It’s not the specific people that bug me. I’m sur they’re very nice. It’s the concept I’m against. I used the door as an EXAMPLE in my first post.
(adopting tone of patronizing reasonableness)
Why yes, I do.
**
(now I’m sounding patronizingly hurt)
And how do you know why I’m doing it?
**
(adopting tone that is just plain patronizing)
That? Honey, (patting LaurAnge on the head) that died out years ago. You’re tilting at extinct windmills. Except older guys, but they’ll be dead soon, too.
**
(dear God, can this guy get more patronizing?)
Well, you get a good night’s sleep and everything will be hunky dory in the morning! That darned old PM … gurgle … gasp … Somebody help me! … cough … All of the women of the SDMB are trying to kill me…
**
[/QUOTE]
laughs hysterically I actually think you hit that last bit on the nose, dropzone, so I won’t kill you THIS TIME!
And actually, it’s not as dead as you think. A lot of my male friends still believe in it.
(Thanks, Spider Woman)
So, you don’t want them to hold the door out of a sense of:[ul][li]valor,[/li][li]nobility,[/li][li]fairness,[/li][li]courtesy,[/li][li]respect for women,[/li][li]protection of the poor, or[/li][li]etc.?[/ul][/li]FWIW, my Webster’s has the same basic definition, unless these guys are demonstrating martial valor by opening a door.
Maybe these guys’ manners have a sexist history (do they take the street side of the sidewalk for you?), but I don’t see how being an asshole is better than leaning forward to get a door. How hard is it to say “Thanks, but I’ll get it.”?
ps. The waitress where I usually go to lunch calls every man “Hun”. I like the place, but should I stop going there, tell her to stop, or “kick her in her nads”?
pps. As an aside, I was on business in San Jose a while back. No offense to those living there, but the place struck me as being somewhat impersonal. I made it a point to be on my best manners, which, of course, included holding doors for everyone (No, I wasn’t running ahead to get them.) The men tended to break stride and seemed slightly confused by my doing this. With most of the women, I got the impression that they were pleasantly surprised and a couple smiled. No one kicked me in the nads. Regardless of gender, I hope I made everyone’s day a little better.