I really hope this list is a joke. I cringed just reading this, because you sound like every “creepy guy with a crush on me” I’ve ever known. You also sound a touch like my BPD mother. Martyr complex (idealization), impulsive risk-taking, melodramatic, addictive tendencies, attention whoring (abandonment avoidance), etc.
Have you been to therapy/counseling?
I’ll see your research and raise you: Women do not generally prefer alpha males. (I’ve seen research to this effect elsewhere, but this is the best I could find with a quick Google search.) By the same token, I think many women would be surprised to learn how many men don’t particularly prefer the “swimsuit model hottie” phenotype.
Confidence, on the other hand, is universally sexy. And speaking from experience, lack of self-confidence often lies at the core of the Nice Guy’s Lament.
There is some truth to that - but kind, nice people do reach acceptable levels of status. Nice guys with no ambition to be anything other than a doormat don’t. Few of us REALLY want the alpha male - the guy who works 80 hour weeks, is driven to succeed. But we do what a guy who is going to hold down a decent job, mow the lawn
i.e. if you are a 24 year old nice guy living with your parents and working part time, it isn’t exactly boding well for a 24 year old woman to end up living in a house with a white picket fence and driving the kids to soccer practice in her minivan in any timeline she wants.
What was said above is true for a lot of women, they plan. They think ahead.
It’s selfish, though. You’re not only depriving her of the ability to feel good about making you happy, because your main desire is that she is happy, you’re also putting enormous pressure on her to be happy all the time. No one is going to be happy all the time; that’s just life. And, “to feel so deeply for another person that metaphorically it feels like you would die without them,” is something that isn’t healthy to have in the beginning of a relationship- it sounds like you’re letting your infatuation run wild. Do you actually tell girls this? Because that puts enormous pressure on them to stay with you. No one wants to be guilt-tripped into acting happy and staying in a relationship. That’s not chivalry, it’s creepy.
Everything you’ve said here indicates to me that accidentalyuppie is correct. You’re not actually interested in other people’s experiences and opinions, you just want to defend your current actions (which, by the way, are not working for you or you wouldn’t have started this thread) when everyone’s trying to give you some useful advice.
That’s the bad news. The good news? You’ll probably grow out of it; most of the Nice Guys that I knew in college did grow out of it and have nice, normal girlfriends now, and they seem to be the happiest now that I’ve ever seen them. There’s still an exception or two running around, threatening that “one of these days he’s going to stop being nice and screw 'em and leave 'em.” Those guys are not happy. They’ve never really seemed happy, though, so maybe they like it.
Let’s not let this be a pile on to the OP. Look, we all realize that the guy who “wishes women would like nice guys like him” is really annoying especially because these threads seem to come up so much. But - we can help Auto here, without being so condescending of him. I’m not referring to one poster in particular, just saying that let’s all be nice people and work together to give him good advice so he can use it. Further criticism of him is just going to make him feel more down on himself, which is not going to help him if he has the personal psychology that he has described.
He is a young guy. He is in a very common situation for young guys to be in. Catch it now before he gets too old.
You’ve had some success with women, so obviously there’s something about you that some women like. That alone should give you some confidence. Just don’t think of all women as a monolithic group. All guys tend to think this way when they’re teenagers but after a certain point it becomes a sign of immaturity, which is never an asset. Just approach each individual woman as an individual woman. Not even as a woman, just as a person. Don’t put women on a pedestal. They’re just people. It’s not like you’re dealing with a wild antelope or something.
Gah, threads like this thread are so frustrating. Women don’t want doormats, women don’t want alpha men… women want different things because women are not one entity with one mind who want one thing. We are not slaves to our genes or our reproductive organs. If no woman anywhere wants to date you (which is unlikely, really), then maybe something’s wrong with you and not all women.
I’m 27. Two years ago, almost to the day, I married the nicest man I have ever met. He is unfailingly kind and generous, genuinely cares for other people (including strangers), loves animals and nature, treats me as his equal, is ridiculously smart and funny, is a great cook, and he has a great ass. He loves to bake, but since there’s no way I can eat everything he makes, he’s always taking cupcakes or pumpkin bars out to the homeless men who sleep in the parking lot across the street; he’s also been known to give homeless people half of his meal or a clean pair of socks without them even asking. More than once he’s helped me search for stray animals I’ve seen on the street to make sure they’re okay. I consider myself the luckiest person in the world because I get to wake up next to him. And for some reason, he thinks the same about me. See, he thinks I’m terrific and he respects me, but he never puts me on a pedestal, he sees my faults, and he lets me be the selfless one sometimes. He sees me as I am, and I don’t feel I have to live up to some crazy idealized version of myself he’s made up in his head. I also know he likes me for more than my pussy.
I’ve never dated a man who was a jerk, and I’ve never rejected a guy because he didn’t have sufficient earning potential. I don’t like a challenge when it comes to relationships; I like honesty. Maybe all the women you are into are jerks because I know not all women are like me or think like me. I just really, really want to caution against taking any generalization about “what women want” at face value.
That is a good point. This is a pretty common thing for young males to go through, which is partly why so many people can speak to the topic. A lot of people experience it one way or the other. I don’t see anyone piling on here, rather most people have come to a consensus that the “nice guy” myth is just that, a myth. I see lots of good advice here for Auto, but it is doubtful he will listen to any of it now; most “nice guys” just want to lament their situation or over analyze everything and not really take action. It seems apparent from his responses which path he is leaning towards taking.
I don’t think anyone is being condescending either. In cases like this something needs to snap the “nice guy’s” head out of the self-imposed fog; far better some posters on a message board attempt to slap him with reality than many of the other alternatives happening.
What a load of malarky. Let me tell you something, in life like attracts like. If a woman places an emphasis on riches and prestige over other qualities, she will find a man who does so as well. It doesn’t have shit to do with alpha males or not being a nice guy. Besides, who says nice guys can’t make money? Additionally, if “alpha male” is a truism you are confusing correlation and causation. Men are attractive to women because they possess certain qualities, that are often attributed to “alpha males”; they don’t suddenly become an alpha male and then attractive.
I think like attracts like is an important thing for all people to remember. If you are complaining that all the women you encounter like jerks, there is something in common between you and those women. All men you have dated are assholes? The link those men share is you. If you honestly feel that all the people you come across are fucked in the head, you probably are fucked in the head; hold a mirror to yourself and figure out what needs to change to stop the pattern. To apply this to “nice guys”, nice guys are often manipulative cowards; it is no surprise that they will be attracted to, or attract, women who are sketchy and manipulative. A sketchy and manipulative woman will dice up a man’s soul like nothing else can, leaving many “nice guys” even more emotionally turbulent and resentful. Hence the passion with which so many decry “Women don’t like nice guys!”
I thought she had many good points. Drop the lens of immediate defensiveness and re-read the post. You obviously aren’t a dumb person, try to approach this with more objectivity.
Argent Towers, we’ve just successfully browbeaten him into giving up smoking. Why stop the pile-on just when it’s showing results? 
Maybe we should start on the drinking and the fast food now…
[Moderator Admonition]You can either take the advice, reject the advice or ignore the advice, but try to remember which forum you are in, o.k.?[/Moderator Admonition]
My problem with meeting women is that I always assume they’re tired of being hit on, so I do 'em the favor of not doing it. Maybe it’s just that last remnant of childhood shyness I can’t get rid of.
Nah, I don’t want to sound like I’m blaming him for a nasty aspect of my personality. His passiveness allowed me to act out and be bitchy in ways that I’m a little horrified at now. As a reformed (married to a nice guy) bitch I can understand that just because some has written “doormat” on their face I don’t have to stomp on it.
If I’m remembering correctly, our last argument, the one that pushed me over the egde, was about which movie to see. He refused to make a decision and it was infuriating.
Well no, just as a plate of food placed in front of me isn’t sufficient to make me want to eat it. There has to be interest there for other reasons (shared sense of humor, same taste in movies, physical attraction) to begin with.
If I found that my husband had been doing that for me, I’d be torn between slapping him for being an idiot or crying in despair. Probably both. I’d be horrified that he would do that to himself and hide it from me. We’re partners, not mistress and manservant.
My husband is a good man but not a Nice Guy. He’s not an alpha male but is outgoing, tall, strong. He’s always been overweight. He’s not a huge moneymaker executive dude like women are supposed to want; he’s a letter carrier for the USPS while I work in research. He’s my best friend but didn’t do the “see what a good friend I am and all the nice favors I do? now do you love me? please?” moves. Hell, I did that as a teenager and found out with repeated experience that it doesn’t work. It makes you maybe a friend, then a kind of pitiable, clingy ‘friend.’
I forgot to add: in the (probably-paraphrased) words of Dan Savage of “Savage Love” - every relationship you get into will fail. Until you find the one that doesn’t.
And finally, there are many mature women your own age. Really. It’ll take some looking, but most anything worthwhile does.
Autolycus, I strongly strongly strongly urge you to find that book I mentioned earlier, “What Women Want Men To Know.” Your “fuck you” response is exactly the kind of response that is documented in that book as being perplexing to women.
And here’s why: a man is in need of help, and so a woman reaches out with the benefit of perception and her love and her ability to care, and she tries to help. Rather than accept a gesture of love and caring, the man lashes out. He perceives this gesture as “you are a bad person, you can’t do anything right, here’s how to do it, you’re such an idiot, you are inadequate.”
What she meant was “it disturbs me to see you acting this way, and I think I can see what you’re doing wrong, and I want to help you, because I want things to be better for you.”
So the man lashes out because he misinterpreets her, and the woman is hurt and rejected because she has no idea how she has become so badly misunderstood.
Okay, okay, okay, ladyfoxfyre’s response was a splash of cold water. It might not have been the answer you were looking for, or in the tone you had hoped to see. I won’t defend her post, or insist that it was meant constructively, but the hyperdefensive reaction is something which really confuses and alienates women.
Please, do yourself a favor and learn more about what your true faults are when it comes to women. 
If this is an honest list:
I’d say he does have a handle on what his problem is. So Autolycus, what are you doing to do about this list? Would you find these qualities attractive in a woman?
No, I don’t think I have. I’ve heard women express dismay that men seem to prefer sexy dimwits, but no intelligent but physically unattractive woman I’ve ever known said that her sole problem was that she was too smart for men. In other words, none seemed to think that men shy away from smart, independent women who also look like Playboy centerfolds.
All sounds like insecurity to me. Everyone but you can see it.
Autolycus, you’re suffering because of your last break up. I hope things get better for you soon. And that you soon stop posting things like that above. Seriously. And good luck with the smoking thing, it is a hard thing to quit, I hear (I’m not a smoker).
Dude, the times I want a guy to dominate me are… extremely extremely few. But respect? Hell yea, I want that all the time (just like I do my best to be respectful to those around me all the time).
It seems you’re interested in serious relationships. Nothing bad about that. Just realize that at your age, many other single females may not be interested in those things. Either you can relax and date just to date and pass time, not thinking (for some time) in the future, or keep doing what you’re doing (and have less dates).
Of course, when I see threads like this I wonder what the response would be from the other side, a single woman bitching against men. I’m sure the Nice Guys would be offended and will rant against her, whether deservedly or not. But I think it is important to look from the other perspective, too. Autolycus, what is your view of nice women that don’t get guys? Do you think that because of their niceness, they deserve a man (say a nice man just as yourself)?
Because of niceness, no woman is entitled to a man. Because of niceness, no man is entitled to a woman. I do not berate men that are not interested in me (even though I am in them), just as I don’t feel the least guilty about not being interested in guys that are interested in me.
I’d venture a guess that there may be other problems he is unaware of, having seen what may be an example of it. In any case, it certainly couldn’t hurt him to investigate further.
Yeah, the tone was probably a bit more than he was expecting but that’s part of the point. None of the so-called Nice Guys think this “phenomenon” is irritating to women. They think it’s everything women are looking for if they’d just notice them and figure it out. My point, and I think the point of many of the women here, is that we know you’re out there, these are precisely the qualities that many people don’t like.
It wasn’t meant entirely constructively, and it was a little cathartic for me considering how many times I’ve seen this same attitude from my friends.
Auto, yeah, we did meet in person, but you can’t really expect to post something like this and not be met with a few pissed off women. My opinions in this thread are entirely the result of the things that you have said throughout the board, not your behavior from the one time we met in person.